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We are joined by Patrick Nagato, author of

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The Canoe in the Current.

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As a retirement strategist and chartered financial consultant,

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Patrick helps clients live fulfilling lives through intentional

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navigation, knowing themselves, understanding their environment and choosing

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their best path ahead instead of drifting.

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Get ready to learn how to help clients

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build their canoe and navigate the current on

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this episode of the Wicked Pissa podcast.

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It's time for a Wicked Pissa podcast.

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Wicked Pissa podcast.

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Wicked Pissa podcast.

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It's time for a Wicked Pissa podcast.

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Welcome to the Wicked Pissa podcast, a production

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of the Financial Planning Association of New England,

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intended for financial planning advisors.

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Welcome to another episode of the Wicked Pissa

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podcast.

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I'm Kevin Williams, past president and current board

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member of the FPA of New England and

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founder of Full Life Financial Planning.

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I'm excited to be joined by Patrick J.

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Nagato, CHFC, a retirement income strategist and chartered

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financial consultant with a mission to help people

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transition from fear and uncertainty to clarity and

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confidence.

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After years of following traditional accumulation-based models,

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Patrick experienced a pivotal moment when a seemingly

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well-prepared client asked him, What if I

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run out?

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That question sparked a journey that led him

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to rethink everything he'd learned.

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Today, Patrick specializes in helping pre-retirees and

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retirees develop income-first strategies that provide lifetime

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guarantees for essential expenses while still allowing for

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growth through market participation.

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His signature metaphor and the title to his

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book, The Canoe and the Current, has helped

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clients understand that true retirement success comes from

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balance, protection and participation, safety, and strength.

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With a passion for cutting through the noise

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of misinformation, Patrick offers a fresh, human-centered

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approach to retirement.

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His work empowers individuals to retire, not just

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with enough money, but with peace of mind,

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dignity, and freedom.

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Welcome, Patrick.

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Hi, Kevin.

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Thank you for that introduction.

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Glad to have you too.

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I'm so excited to dig in a little

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bit and talk about what you've done with

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clients as a specialist in preparing for and

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surviving retirement and also dig into your book

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that was released this summer as it's a

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very exciting way to frame planning for retirement

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and focusing on what's important and how to

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navigate some dangers in retirement.

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How about tell us a little bit about

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yourself, your background, and how you got to

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where you are in your career today?

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Thank you.

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Yeah.

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So I entered the industry in 1997.

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Prior to that, I was in high-end

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retail, but then I worked for a software

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company that worked with financial advisors.

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So that's how I got exposed to the

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industry.

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So in 1997, I got licensed.

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And when some of us kind of start

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with either brokerage firms or life insurance companies

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or life insurance financial services firms, I got

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started in life insurance financial services.

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So entering the industry, I was always the

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skeptic, the cynic, whatever you want to call

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it.

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I was a very uncoachable person.

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For some of us who entered through the

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life insurance channel first, before they'll let us

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get our securities licenses, they always want us

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to sell some life insurance first, preferably permanent

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life insurance coverage.

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But I insisted on getting my securities licenses

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because I didn't want to be pigeonholed into

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just being a life insurance salesman.

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But with that said, between 1997 and 2000,

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I struggled quite a bit, had second jobs

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here and there to survive.

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For some of us, I don't know how

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people do it nowadays, but I did a

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lot of cold calling back in those days.

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Essentially in 1999, landed my biggest client that

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kind of got me to survive in the

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business.

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Then in 2001, I started my own RIA

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at that point, but did it, in my

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opinion, unwisely.

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I should have done it better, but I

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didn't know any better.

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And so I struggled.

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I mean, I did well, but I struggled

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to keep it up.

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And I decided to sell that portion of

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it in 2003.

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And essentially I wanted to get out of

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the business.

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I was kind of one of those people

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who most of us kind of don't make

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it.

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And I was in the process of, I

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don't know if I want to stay or

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go.

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And so I ended up getting into wholesale.

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So I started wholesaling to financial advisors, in

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this case, life insurance wholesale.

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But then after I got tired of doing

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that, because I felt like I knew better

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than the bank brokers channels or the warehouse

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people on how to sell life insurance, I

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became essentially, what do they call it?

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Which was similar to a bank wholesaler, but

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I was working with an insurance company.

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So I was the financial services specialist for

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an insurance company's customer base.

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So we did that and then did really

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well.

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And then started to transition my practice more

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into investment management.

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I got called by a recruiter to be

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a wholesaler, and that was a position I

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always wanted to give a shot.

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And so I got back into wholesaling, this

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time for a large insurance company.

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Did that for a few years, then went

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into management, had a branch that I was

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managing.

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And then I just realized I am just

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not a good employee, because as a branch

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manager, you're still dealing with a regional director.

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And my wife says, why don't we just

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go back into personal production?

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That's where you seem to be at your

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best.

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And so that's what I did.

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I went back into personal production, and that's

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where we are now.

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I mean, essentially my practice has evolved from

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the beginning as a life insurance person to

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now having assets under management and really trying

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to focus on retirement planning or retirement income

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planning for clients.

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I guess as the old saying goes, you

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kind of mature into your market.

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And so I'm now in my 50s.

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These are the people I'm running into.

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So it's easy to specialize in the retirement

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income space.

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Not unlike many people that I run into

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in the business and many of our members

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at FPA New England is that a lot

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of folks in this business have had quite

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an interesting journey.

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It's not uncommon to have folks that started

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out in a different career and also who

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have seen a lot of different approaches to

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working in the business.

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And as you noted, kind of found their

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way into the space that works best for

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them, where they enjoy it, where they can

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find success and happiness in their career, as

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well as providing value, obviously, to their clients.

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So that's fantastic.

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And excited to talk to you about it,

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especially because it sounds like your business, as

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we talked ahead of this call, you've really

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kind of created a practice, which sounds like

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your approach to working with clients and what

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you encourage them to focus on as they

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lead into retirement or navigating their way through

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retirement, much aligns with the approach that I've

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taken with clients focusing on what constitutes a

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life of purpose and reward over focusing just

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on assets and returns to really find that

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life that is meaningful to them and then

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work with you to find a way to

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make sure that they can financially achieve that.

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Because I think I usually like to say,

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if we've been in this business, we're survivors,

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right?

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We managed to make it because the attrition

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rate is quite high, right?

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I mean, people just don't make it.

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I mean, when I was a manager, I

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was branch manager, we knew that the lifespan

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of a typical advisor is about two years.

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After that, they either make it or they

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wash out.

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As you're mentioning practice, I think our practices

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constantly evolve over time as we gain more

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experience, as we develop different types of clientele.

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And like I said, I just happened to

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be in my 50s now, and I was

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able to essentially fall into a more specific

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marketplace that I envisioned myself working years ago.

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But let's call it, when you're 30, 35

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years old, it might not be quite the

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same because you're meeting different demographics versus now,

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right?

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So I thought I'd just chime in with

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that comment.

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You've settled into kind of a focus on

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being a retirement strategist.

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What are you seeing as the biggest concerns

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for clients?

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Obviously, it's very uncertain times in a lot

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of ways, both in a short-term picture,

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but also a long-term picture.

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What types of concerns do your clients bring

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to the table?

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What's the primary focus of trying to settle

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their fears?

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Well, I think that the main thing that's

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part of how I developed the book and

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essentially helping people develop also a retirement vision

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statement is there's two types of clientele, right?

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I'm oversimplifying in this case, but one is

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overconfident.

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And generally, they retire, they feel good about

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it, and then they start worrying, is it

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going to be enough?

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Then you have people who are not so

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confident.

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They don't think they have enough, but in

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some cases, they have more than enough.

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The reason we're in business, and despite of

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what people might think, our job is not

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to get you the best returns.

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I mean, our job is to help you

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make the right decisions when it comes to

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your finances, despite of how you feel about

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it emotionally.

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So the one thing that I say when

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I'm talking to potential clients or clients is

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my job is to help you see what's

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around the corner, because you haven't experienced that

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yet.

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And I've dealt with enough clients who have

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experienced that, that I can at least, from

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a probability standpoint, be able to tell you

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this is what's around the corner that we

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have to plan for.

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So I think the majority of the people

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I deal with, they retire.

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And then the next thing they thought, or

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at least they plan to retire, and then

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they're thinking, I thought this would feel better.

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And they're either worried.

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One client in particular was overconfident after he

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read my book.

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And again, in the case of, I don't

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know about you, but in my case, sometimes

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clients go through the whole process.

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Sometimes it's a little bit more transactional before

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they go through the whole process.

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But I try to accommodate as much as

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I can.

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So this one particular client, we had a

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conversation just a couple months ago, he's retired.

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He's been retired for a couple of years.

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And he said, Patrick, after reading your book,

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I don't know if I have enough.

273
00:10:54,790 --> 00:10:56,210
And so I had to reassure him.

274
00:10:56,250 --> 00:10:57,850
I said, I know your finances.

275
00:10:58,090 --> 00:11:00,290
I know your spending habits.

276
00:11:00,710 --> 00:11:01,590
You do have enough.

277
00:11:01,990 --> 00:11:03,690
Let me kind of reiterate what you have,

278
00:11:03,710 --> 00:11:04,690
and we can go over that again.

279
00:11:04,870 --> 00:11:06,890
So that's a common theme where people are

280
00:11:06,890 --> 00:11:08,710
like, I thought this would feel better from

281
00:11:08,710 --> 00:11:10,910
a standpoint that I'm worried about my money.

282
00:11:11,310 --> 00:11:13,330
In some instances, I thought this would feel

283
00:11:13,330 --> 00:11:14,550
better, but I'm really bored.

284
00:11:14,710 --> 00:11:15,710
And I don't know what to do with

285
00:11:15,710 --> 00:11:16,190
my time.

286
00:11:16,310 --> 00:11:18,010
So I don't know about you, Kevin, but

287
00:11:18,010 --> 00:11:20,050
that's who I run across is those types

288
00:11:20,050 --> 00:11:20,710
of conversations.

289
00:11:21,350 --> 00:11:23,970
And so developing the book and developing the

290
00:11:23,970 --> 00:11:27,210
process, I realized that it's important for people

291
00:11:27,210 --> 00:11:29,410
to think about, now that you're about to

292
00:11:29,410 --> 00:11:33,750
retire, perhaps you should consider writing a retirement

293
00:11:33,750 --> 00:11:34,590
vision statement.

294
00:11:35,250 --> 00:11:37,670
So I developed a questionnaire so people can

295
00:11:37,670 --> 00:11:39,870
at least complete it and think about it

296
00:11:39,870 --> 00:11:42,530
with their spouses and maybe even their kids.

297
00:11:43,250 --> 00:11:44,930
What does retirement look like to them?

298
00:11:45,250 --> 00:11:47,670
Because most people, when they think about retiring,

299
00:11:47,710 --> 00:11:49,110
it's just a matter of, I want to

300
00:11:49,110 --> 00:11:49,630
stop working.

301
00:11:49,930 --> 00:11:51,050
I want to start enjoying my life.

302
00:11:51,210 --> 00:11:52,930
But they haven't really defined what that means.

303
00:11:53,370 --> 00:11:54,550
Are we going to travel a lot?

304
00:11:54,730 --> 00:11:57,050
Are we going to be babysitters to our

305
00:11:57,050 --> 00:11:57,650
grandkids?

306
00:11:58,570 --> 00:12:00,410
Are we going to play golf all the

307
00:12:00,410 --> 00:12:00,770
time?

308
00:12:01,770 --> 00:12:03,490
So it's just a matter of being able

309
00:12:03,490 --> 00:12:05,650
to define that for themselves so that we

310
00:12:05,650 --> 00:12:08,150
can plan their finances around that and then

311
00:12:08,150 --> 00:12:11,090
help them see, based on what their vision

312
00:12:11,090 --> 00:12:13,710
is, what the potential pitfalls are with what

313
00:12:13,710 --> 00:12:14,470
could happen there.

314
00:12:15,970 --> 00:12:18,630
So that's kind of like part of the

315
00:12:18,630 --> 00:12:20,330
assistance process, so to speak, or helping them

316
00:12:20,330 --> 00:12:21,130
think things through.

317
00:12:21,990 --> 00:12:25,190
Because once somebody retires, there's no looking back.

318
00:12:25,510 --> 00:12:27,050
Chances are you can't go back to work.

319
00:12:27,510 --> 00:12:30,030
So we got to make sure that this

320
00:12:30,030 --> 00:12:32,330
is rock solid as far as your money

321
00:12:32,330 --> 00:12:35,850
goes, your paychecks, and what your lifestyle is

322
00:12:35,850 --> 00:12:36,450
going to look like.

323
00:12:36,950 --> 00:12:40,730
Not that retirement is any different in terms

324
00:12:40,730 --> 00:12:44,170
of this for a successful plan.

325
00:12:44,370 --> 00:12:46,630
But as you said, just trying to get

326
00:12:46,630 --> 00:12:49,270
a vision for what they expect.

327
00:12:49,750 --> 00:12:53,610
If you're working with a couple heading into

328
00:12:53,610 --> 00:12:56,890
retirement and there hasn't been a lot of

329
00:12:56,890 --> 00:12:59,550
discussion as to what it's going to look

330
00:12:59,550 --> 00:13:02,870
like when they get there, I've seen situations

331
00:13:02,870 --> 00:13:05,450
where it can be very problematic because they

332
00:13:05,450 --> 00:13:06,470
both want to get there.

333
00:13:06,770 --> 00:13:11,170
They both have that general idea of, we

334
00:13:11,170 --> 00:13:12,410
can't wait to retire.

335
00:13:13,110 --> 00:13:15,350
But then they have a totally different vision

336
00:13:15,350 --> 00:13:16,870
of what that's going to look like.

337
00:13:17,230 --> 00:13:20,010
And that's a rough road when they get

338
00:13:20,010 --> 00:13:21,350
there to try to get on the same

339
00:13:21,350 --> 00:13:21,750
page.

340
00:13:21,930 --> 00:13:25,530
And sometimes they don't, just because they haven't

341
00:13:26,110 --> 00:13:30,090
planned for or they aren't on the same

342
00:13:30,090 --> 00:13:32,670
page as to what they will do.

343
00:13:33,170 --> 00:13:36,670
As you said, one of them plans to

344
00:13:36,670 --> 00:13:38,550
golf and one of them plans to travel.

345
00:13:39,090 --> 00:13:42,970
Or one of them plans to relocate to

346
00:13:42,970 --> 00:13:45,490
warmer climates and one of them wants to

347
00:13:45,490 --> 00:13:49,490
stay around and local with the grandkids.

348
00:13:49,770 --> 00:13:52,410
So the sooner that they can communicate and

349
00:13:52,410 --> 00:13:55,350
be on the same page, obviously it helps.

350
00:13:55,590 --> 00:13:58,050
And you can only help with the financial

351
00:13:58,050 --> 00:14:01,450
piece, but having that questionnaire, which gets a

352
00:14:01,450 --> 00:14:04,550
couple talking or gets the, even if it's

353
00:14:04,550 --> 00:14:06,370
not a couple thinking about what things are

354
00:14:06,370 --> 00:14:10,210
going to look like, provides a smoother glide

355
00:14:10,210 --> 00:14:11,390
path into retirement.

356
00:14:11,570 --> 00:14:12,250
That's for certain.

357
00:14:12,670 --> 00:14:14,590
So here's an example of an extreme.

358
00:14:14,790 --> 00:14:17,650
I have this one particular client I can

359
00:14:17,650 --> 00:14:18,110
think of.

360
00:14:18,510 --> 00:14:20,730
They are now in their eighties.

361
00:14:21,550 --> 00:14:26,110
They worked really hard for tech firms and

362
00:14:26,110 --> 00:14:27,010
done really well.

363
00:14:27,610 --> 00:14:29,890
They have money just that's coming to them

364
00:14:29,890 --> 00:14:31,490
now that they're not even looking for it.

365
00:14:31,530 --> 00:14:32,950
Their investment returns are doing well.

366
00:14:33,490 --> 00:14:34,790
They're selling properties.

367
00:14:35,090 --> 00:14:36,290
They're doing quite well.

368
00:14:36,770 --> 00:14:40,330
And so until about five years ago, they

369
00:14:40,330 --> 00:14:43,350
were traveling on a regular basis once or

370
00:14:43,350 --> 00:14:45,130
twice a year to enjoy their retirement.

371
00:14:45,750 --> 00:14:48,550
Well, unfortunately their daughter had a stroke.

372
00:14:48,850 --> 00:14:50,950
And so now they've had to be caretakers

373
00:14:50,950 --> 00:14:51,550
for their daughter.

374
00:14:51,830 --> 00:14:53,530
And so their money is just, they're no

375
00:14:53,530 --> 00:14:54,550
longer spending their money.

376
00:14:55,130 --> 00:14:57,350
They're spending money in some cases, but they're

377
00:14:57,350 --> 00:14:59,270
not spending nearly as much because they're not

378
00:14:59,270 --> 00:15:00,070
traveling anymore.

379
00:15:00,290 --> 00:15:01,510
They're taking care of her.

380
00:15:02,210 --> 00:15:04,870
It's both a nice problem and a bad

381
00:15:04,870 --> 00:15:06,530
problem because they would like to enjoy their

382
00:15:06,530 --> 00:15:07,110
money more.

383
00:15:08,090 --> 00:15:09,630
But they obviously love their daughter and they're

384
00:15:09,630 --> 00:15:10,450
taking care of her.

385
00:15:11,370 --> 00:15:14,770
But now that they're approaching the mid eighties,

386
00:15:14,790 --> 00:15:17,350
they have to have a plan on finding

387
00:15:17,350 --> 00:15:18,730
a caretaker for their daughter.

388
00:15:20,050 --> 00:15:21,190
But that's an extreme example.

389
00:15:21,310 --> 00:15:23,370
They've done quite well for themselves and they

390
00:15:23,370 --> 00:15:24,410
continue to do well.

391
00:15:25,530 --> 00:15:27,970
And I like to tease the husband and

392
00:15:27,970 --> 00:15:30,770
say, you're finding money everywhere where some people

393
00:15:30,770 --> 00:15:31,370
are losing it.

394
00:15:34,150 --> 00:15:35,890
You're enjoying it because we have to take

395
00:15:35,890 --> 00:15:37,210
care of our daughter, but we're going to

396
00:15:37,210 --> 00:15:37,830
try to fix that.

397
00:15:38,030 --> 00:15:39,210
So anyway, I thought I'd just kind of

398
00:15:39,210 --> 00:15:41,770
share that because that's another extreme where they've

399
00:15:41,770 --> 00:15:43,570
done quite well for themselves, continue to do

400
00:15:43,570 --> 00:15:43,850
well.

401
00:15:44,190 --> 00:15:45,710
Again, what's around the corner.

402
00:15:46,050 --> 00:15:48,310
No one foresaw that coming where they had

403
00:15:48,310 --> 00:15:49,210
to take care of their daughter.

404
00:15:49,650 --> 00:15:50,010
Absolutely.

405
00:15:50,490 --> 00:15:54,150
And I'm glad that it sounds like financially

406
00:15:54,150 --> 00:15:57,790
they're in a good enough spot to make

407
00:15:57,790 --> 00:16:00,670
that work and hopefully things end up going

408
00:16:00,670 --> 00:16:01,810
well for their daughter.

409
00:16:02,070 --> 00:16:03,770
But things can change very quick.

410
00:16:04,030 --> 00:16:06,130
And that's why you have to be ready

411
00:16:06,130 --> 00:16:10,090
to reset that vision statement that you have,

412
00:16:10,310 --> 00:16:13,910
because as you said, nobody knows what's around

413
00:16:13,910 --> 00:16:14,450
the corner.

414
00:16:14,970 --> 00:16:18,050
You mentioned, as you said, that you have

415
00:16:18,050 --> 00:16:22,190
broadly one of two types of people entering

416
00:16:22,190 --> 00:16:23,450
or in retirement.

417
00:16:23,690 --> 00:16:27,510
One is the overconfident and one is the

418
00:16:27,510 --> 00:16:28,410
underconfident.

419
00:16:28,710 --> 00:16:32,030
Their common denominator is they don't know what

420
00:16:32,030 --> 00:16:32,770
they don't know.

421
00:16:33,550 --> 00:16:35,330
What are you seeing?

422
00:16:35,450 --> 00:16:39,010
And obviously, as you mentioned there, you just

423
00:16:39,010 --> 00:16:42,790
shared with us an outlying event, but what

424
00:16:42,790 --> 00:16:46,770
do you see as the biggest risks up

425
00:16:46,770 --> 00:16:50,830
around the corner that tend to take people

426
00:16:50,830 --> 00:16:55,390
off of their retirement plan and get them

427
00:16:55,390 --> 00:16:56,950
off of a path of success?

428
00:16:56,950 --> 00:17:00,230
Well, I think a couple of things.

429
00:17:00,350 --> 00:17:03,030
One is, and this is often talked about,

430
00:17:03,470 --> 00:17:04,430
long-term care.

431
00:17:04,770 --> 00:17:06,109
If you were to need long-term care

432
00:17:06,109 --> 00:17:08,810
or any sort of extended healthcare services as

433
00:17:08,810 --> 00:17:12,230
you get older, that would obviously affect your

434
00:17:12,230 --> 00:17:16,510
finances because those costs are just rising.

435
00:17:16,910 --> 00:17:20,050
The other thing is there are people who

436
00:17:20,050 --> 00:17:21,450
just fall in love with their investments.

437
00:17:21,950 --> 00:17:24,369
I mean, we've had a pretty decent run

438
00:17:24,369 --> 00:17:27,410
except for a few bumps here and there.

439
00:17:28,650 --> 00:17:31,570
And so what tends to happen is people

440
00:17:31,570 --> 00:17:33,650
tend to fall in love with their investments

441
00:17:33,650 --> 00:17:36,230
that have done well, instead of planning and

442
00:17:36,230 --> 00:17:39,430
saying, okay, now we need to start thinking

443
00:17:39,430 --> 00:17:41,030
about how we're going to make sure this

444
00:17:41,030 --> 00:17:42,590
accumulates properly.

445
00:17:43,390 --> 00:17:44,890
I call it the accumulation trap.

446
00:17:45,170 --> 00:17:47,970
We're so used to saving money, saving money,

447
00:17:47,970 --> 00:17:49,470
and then investing it, investing it, and doing

448
00:17:49,470 --> 00:17:50,310
well with the investments.

449
00:17:50,990 --> 00:17:55,130
Once the investments do well, then it's time

450
00:17:55,130 --> 00:17:57,670
to start harvesting some of that to make

451
00:17:57,670 --> 00:18:00,050
sure we either build your canoe or at

452
00:18:00,050 --> 00:18:02,550
least protect it from any sort of market

453
00:18:02,550 --> 00:18:03,050
volatility.

454
00:18:04,030 --> 00:18:06,970
But there are people who just don't want

455
00:18:06,970 --> 00:18:11,230
to make any changes until something really bad

456
00:18:11,230 --> 00:18:12,150
happens in the market.

457
00:18:12,150 --> 00:18:13,690
And then that's when they make the change

458
00:18:13,690 --> 00:18:15,150
and realize the actual loss.

459
00:18:16,150 --> 00:18:19,310
And so I think those are the challenges

460
00:18:19,310 --> 00:18:22,470
I think most people that I've run across,

461
00:18:22,990 --> 00:18:25,050
the challenges I face with them, because I

462
00:18:25,050 --> 00:18:26,510
have to try to persuade them.

463
00:18:26,990 --> 00:18:28,670
We need to start thinking about this in

464
00:18:28,670 --> 00:18:29,490
a different way.

465
00:18:29,810 --> 00:18:31,990
And again, that's part of the inspiration for

466
00:18:31,990 --> 00:18:34,050
the book, is to, I feel like I

467
00:18:34,050 --> 00:18:36,190
don't communicate that well enough or it doesn't

468
00:18:36,190 --> 00:18:36,970
resonate with them.

469
00:18:37,190 --> 00:18:38,610
So the book was kind of developed out

470
00:18:38,610 --> 00:18:41,730
of really frustration in most cases, and just

471
00:18:41,730 --> 00:18:43,010
to be able to say, why don't you

472
00:18:43,010 --> 00:18:43,390
read this?

473
00:18:43,430 --> 00:18:45,470
You can kind of get my thoughts on

474
00:18:45,470 --> 00:18:48,770
the matter, because it's not uncommon for people

475
00:18:48,770 --> 00:18:49,690
to say, I don't want to do that

476
00:18:49,690 --> 00:18:49,890
yet.

477
00:18:50,030 --> 00:18:51,910
I want to continue to ride this investment

478
00:18:51,910 --> 00:18:53,710
until I think it's the right time.

479
00:18:54,590 --> 00:18:56,370
So that's my experience with it.

480
00:18:56,670 --> 00:19:02,370
And there's definitely an argument to some extent

481
00:19:02,370 --> 00:19:06,250
to take the approach of let winners win

482
00:19:06,250 --> 00:19:10,890
for a little bit and not necessarily rebalance

483
00:19:10,890 --> 00:19:12,770
on a daily basis.

484
00:19:13,010 --> 00:19:17,610
And I'm exaggerating there, but let things creep

485
00:19:17,610 --> 00:19:21,330
a little bit off of your intended asset

486
00:19:21,330 --> 00:19:24,470
allocation path to just ride out a little

487
00:19:24,470 --> 00:19:25,210
bit of success.

488
00:19:25,390 --> 00:19:30,810
But there's certainly, there's a timeframe where that

489
00:19:30,810 --> 00:19:35,030
marriage to the success a certain stock has

490
00:19:35,030 --> 00:19:38,830
had, very important to reign that in and

491
00:19:38,830 --> 00:19:41,810
make it an actual win, not just a

492
00:19:41,810 --> 00:19:43,390
win on paper for certain.

493
00:19:43,850 --> 00:19:45,790
And no, we see that a lot.

494
00:19:45,910 --> 00:19:51,910
And especially nowadays with so much market appreciation

495
00:19:51,910 --> 00:19:55,490
being in just a handful of stocks, it's

496
00:19:55,490 --> 00:19:58,230
easy for people to fall in love with

497
00:19:58,230 --> 00:20:00,770
those or just the ones that they see

498
00:20:00,770 --> 00:20:04,290
the headlines of, or the one that somebody

499
00:20:04,290 --> 00:20:06,330
recommended to them and it had a huge

500
00:20:06,330 --> 00:20:10,490
jump, but there isn't necessarily any rationale as

501
00:20:10,490 --> 00:20:13,790
to how that fits in their portfolio, but

502
00:20:13,790 --> 00:20:15,850
they just know that it's worth a lot

503
00:20:15,850 --> 00:20:17,390
more than it was when they bought it.

504
00:20:17,530 --> 00:20:19,770
So they're reticent to have you.

505
00:20:20,290 --> 00:20:20,530
Yeah.

506
00:20:20,710 --> 00:20:22,950
And I'm sure you've run across this before

507
00:20:22,950 --> 00:20:23,790
on the listeners.

508
00:20:24,190 --> 00:20:26,770
You take on a potentially new client, they're

509
00:20:26,770 --> 00:20:28,470
very happy with their investments, you run an

510
00:20:28,470 --> 00:20:30,570
analysis and they say, well, I don't really

511
00:20:30,570 --> 00:20:31,230
do anything.

512
00:20:31,410 --> 00:20:32,450
It's done quite well.

513
00:20:32,590 --> 00:20:34,910
And you do the basic analysis and compare

514
00:20:34,910 --> 00:20:36,230
it to just what the S&P 500

515
00:20:36,230 --> 00:20:38,650
index has done and it's underperformed it.

516
00:20:39,270 --> 00:20:41,290
And so you just have that basic conversation.

517
00:20:42,210 --> 00:20:45,030
I don't really like to necessarily compare returns,

518
00:20:45,290 --> 00:20:46,850
but I just usually like to tell people,

519
00:20:46,970 --> 00:20:49,790
listen, based on your profile, you should be

520
00:20:49,790 --> 00:20:52,750
performing better and you're not, but in your

521
00:20:52,750 --> 00:20:54,530
mind, you're performing better and you like it.

522
00:20:54,570 --> 00:20:55,790
But if you just compare it to the

523
00:20:55,790 --> 00:20:58,370
index, you're actually underperforming it.

524
00:20:58,630 --> 00:21:00,210
And so I just make the argument, you

525
00:21:00,210 --> 00:21:03,350
might just be better off, notwithstanding working with

526
00:21:03,350 --> 00:21:05,530
us, just investing in the S&P 500

527
00:21:05,530 --> 00:21:06,990
index and you would have done better.

528
00:21:07,590 --> 00:21:11,830
So people, they have blind spots because they

529
00:21:11,830 --> 00:21:13,050
don't know what, like you said, they don't

530
00:21:13,050 --> 00:21:14,330
know what they don't know.

531
00:21:14,890 --> 00:21:16,890
And that's where the value of working with

532
00:21:16,890 --> 00:21:19,510
us comes in, is we help them look

533
00:21:19,510 --> 00:21:20,450
at the things they don't see.

534
00:21:20,450 --> 00:21:24,990
And they never love the idea of selling

535
00:21:24,990 --> 00:21:26,970
out of something that's done very well and

536
00:21:26,970 --> 00:21:28,790
actually paying taxes on it too.

537
00:21:29,070 --> 00:21:33,050
That's the other sledgehammer over the head that

538
00:21:33,050 --> 00:21:37,710
usually leads them to push back even harder

539
00:21:37,710 --> 00:21:40,010
to not want to sell something because they

540
00:21:40,010 --> 00:21:41,630
don't want to get rid of it and

541
00:21:41,630 --> 00:21:43,250
they don't want to be out cash from

542
00:21:43,250 --> 00:21:43,670
it either.

543
00:21:44,530 --> 00:21:46,050
So one of the challenges I had in

544
00:21:46,050 --> 00:21:48,210
the beginning of my career, I mentioned earlier,

545
00:21:48,350 --> 00:21:52,730
I had that RIA and I was doing

546
00:21:52,730 --> 00:21:54,750
the actual stock picking, all the research and

547
00:21:54,750 --> 00:21:55,090
all that.

548
00:21:55,210 --> 00:21:56,530
And like I said, I think that was

549
00:21:56,530 --> 00:21:58,010
a mistake on my part.

550
00:21:58,650 --> 00:22:00,670
Back then I was a little bit, probably

551
00:22:00,670 --> 00:22:02,050
a little bit more inexperienced than I am

552
00:22:02,050 --> 00:22:02,310
now.

553
00:22:02,430 --> 00:22:03,230
So I would do it a little bit

554
00:22:03,230 --> 00:22:03,430
different.

555
00:22:03,550 --> 00:22:05,490
I'm doing it differently now, what I'm saying.

556
00:22:05,690 --> 00:22:07,970
But back then I would have the conversation

557
00:22:07,970 --> 00:22:09,590
with my client saying, okay, we're going to

558
00:22:09,590 --> 00:22:13,250
buy these particular stocks because they're undervalued based

559
00:22:13,250 --> 00:22:13,850
on my analysis.

560
00:22:14,130 --> 00:22:15,570
And then we're going to sell them when

561
00:22:15,570 --> 00:22:17,770
they reach what we feel is our fair

562
00:22:17,770 --> 00:22:18,770
market value.

563
00:22:19,330 --> 00:22:20,570
And then that way we can kind of

564
00:22:20,570 --> 00:22:23,430
profit and then look for other undervalued stocks

565
00:22:23,430 --> 00:22:24,050
at that point.

566
00:22:24,630 --> 00:22:27,230
So of course, what I didn't foresee at

567
00:22:27,230 --> 00:22:29,530
that time due to lack of experience is

568
00:22:29,530 --> 00:22:32,150
once you reach the fair market value to

569
00:22:32,150 --> 00:22:34,450
think it should be sold at and the

570
00:22:34,450 --> 00:22:37,730
stock ended up going up after that, your

571
00:22:37,730 --> 00:22:39,010
clients weren't happy with you.

572
00:22:39,290 --> 00:22:41,230
Why didn't we ride this further?

573
00:22:41,430 --> 00:22:43,030
Because we could have made more money on

574
00:22:43,030 --> 00:22:43,210
it.

575
00:22:43,950 --> 00:22:46,130
And then likewise, if you didn't sell it

576
00:22:46,130 --> 00:22:48,350
and decided to ride it and the market

577
00:22:48,350 --> 00:22:50,690
and that stock went down, then of course,

578
00:22:50,750 --> 00:22:52,410
you're the bad guy for not selling it.

579
00:22:52,970 --> 00:22:54,790
So it was one of those things where

580
00:22:54,790 --> 00:22:57,710
you don't win for losing or however you

581
00:22:57,710 --> 00:22:58,630
want to say that terminology.

582
00:22:59,830 --> 00:23:02,230
But even when you communicate that this is

583
00:23:02,230 --> 00:23:03,610
the target price you want to sell it

584
00:23:03,610 --> 00:23:06,470
for, because we believe that it will be

585
00:23:06,470 --> 00:23:09,150
overvalued after that and then the stock continued

586
00:23:09,150 --> 00:23:09,650
to rise.

587
00:23:09,870 --> 00:23:12,450
And of course, those clients were unhappy about

588
00:23:12,450 --> 00:23:12,830
that.

589
00:23:13,210 --> 00:23:14,590
So it was one of those things where

590
00:23:14,590 --> 00:23:16,930
they just fall in love with the winners

591
00:23:16,930 --> 00:23:19,430
and they don't think about anything else.

592
00:23:19,810 --> 00:23:21,810
They do as much as you try to

593
00:23:21,810 --> 00:23:24,710
educate them and most of them understand.

594
00:23:25,790 --> 00:23:29,850
There are those that expect that financial advisors

595
00:23:29,850 --> 00:23:31,910
know exactly what's going to happen with the

596
00:23:31,910 --> 00:23:35,490
market and with every individual investment.

597
00:23:36,130 --> 00:23:38,370
And I try to tell them at times

598
00:23:38,370 --> 00:23:40,510
that if I knew exactly what was going

599
00:23:40,510 --> 00:23:42,710
to happen with the market and with every

600
00:23:42,710 --> 00:23:45,370
individual stock, I would just be able to

601
00:23:45,370 --> 00:23:46,850
do it for myself and I wouldn't have

602
00:23:46,850 --> 00:23:47,650
to do it for them.

603
00:23:47,910 --> 00:23:49,110
And you'll be very wealthy.

604
00:23:49,670 --> 00:23:50,730
Yeah, absolutely.

605
00:23:51,430 --> 00:23:54,030
I'd have a lot more time to myself,

606
00:23:54,530 --> 00:23:56,910
but that is tough.

607
00:23:57,270 --> 00:24:01,330
And it's again, part of the value that

608
00:24:01,330 --> 00:24:04,130
we bring is trying to continue to educate

609
00:24:04,130 --> 00:24:10,590
them about the importance of diversification and sticking

610
00:24:10,590 --> 00:24:11,470
to a plan.

611
00:24:11,930 --> 00:24:14,510
And it sounds like you were doing the

612
00:24:14,510 --> 00:24:16,810
right things early, which was having a very

613
00:24:16,810 --> 00:24:20,190
systemic approach to what you were going to

614
00:24:20,190 --> 00:24:23,930
do, because that's how you keep everyone honest

615
00:24:23,930 --> 00:24:26,890
on the same page and on target with

616
00:24:26,890 --> 00:24:29,750
what you've agreed to try to do with

617
00:24:29,750 --> 00:24:34,030
them to make their journey financially successful.

618
00:24:34,590 --> 00:24:39,890
Obviously in retirement, apart from trying to get

619
00:24:39,890 --> 00:24:43,950
on board with your spouse or significant other

620
00:24:43,950 --> 00:24:46,730
as to what your plan is going to

621
00:24:46,730 --> 00:24:50,550
be to enjoy retirement, is that difficult transition

622
00:24:50,550 --> 00:24:54,570
to going away from having a paycheck to

623
00:24:55,370 --> 00:24:57,990
having to become your own paycheck.

624
00:24:58,550 --> 00:25:01,590
As you advise clients, what is your best

625
00:25:01,590 --> 00:25:05,930
strategies for becoming that own paycheck to themselves?

626
00:25:06,350 --> 00:25:09,330
I can be accused of oversimplifying things, sure.

627
00:25:09,990 --> 00:25:13,490
But the general theme, or at least when

628
00:25:13,490 --> 00:25:15,950
we're having the conversations, and we all know

629
00:25:15,950 --> 00:25:17,710
this, let's figure out what your monthly expenses

630
00:25:17,710 --> 00:25:18,010
are.

631
00:25:18,350 --> 00:25:19,910
What are the main essential things you have

632
00:25:19,910 --> 00:25:21,310
to make sure you pay for?

633
00:25:21,930 --> 00:25:23,670
Whether it's if you still have a mortgage,

634
00:25:24,430 --> 00:25:27,870
property taxes, health insurance, food, let's put that

635
00:25:27,870 --> 00:25:29,570
out of the way, let's cover that with

636
00:25:29,570 --> 00:25:30,590
some guaranteed income.

637
00:25:31,130 --> 00:25:33,190
That would be the canoe, part of the

638
00:25:33,190 --> 00:25:34,070
canoe in the current, right?

639
00:25:34,150 --> 00:25:34,510
The canoe.

640
00:25:34,950 --> 00:25:37,450
So what would constitute as guaranteed income?

641
00:25:37,890 --> 00:25:39,090
Obviously, social security.

642
00:25:39,290 --> 00:25:40,890
If you're lucky enough to still have a

643
00:25:40,890 --> 00:25:43,010
pension with your employer, that's going to cover

644
00:25:43,010 --> 00:25:43,750
that as well.

645
00:25:44,790 --> 00:25:46,750
And then really the third piece of it,

646
00:25:46,930 --> 00:25:51,350
that I know we can guarantee is using

647
00:25:51,350 --> 00:25:53,110
guaranteed income annuities.

648
00:25:53,530 --> 00:25:55,890
A lot of people have different opinions on

649
00:25:55,890 --> 00:25:56,230
annuities.

650
00:25:57,070 --> 00:25:58,930
The main thing that I tell them is

651
00:25:58,930 --> 00:26:01,370
what annuities will give you is the ability

652
00:26:01,370 --> 00:26:04,130
to have lifetime income that's guaranteed, that you

653
00:26:04,130 --> 00:26:05,690
never have to worry about running out, of

654
00:26:05,690 --> 00:26:07,530
course, at the claims paying ability of the

655
00:26:07,530 --> 00:26:08,170
insurance carrier.

656
00:26:08,650 --> 00:26:11,490
But we have not had any experiences that

657
00:26:11,490 --> 00:26:13,390
I can think of that insurance companies stop

658
00:26:13,390 --> 00:26:13,710
paying.

659
00:26:14,450 --> 00:26:15,930
So if you can at least cover that

660
00:26:15,930 --> 00:26:19,270
for your canoe, then you can then navigate

661
00:26:19,270 --> 00:26:20,990
the current confidently.

662
00:26:21,170 --> 00:26:22,770
And the current, of course, is investing in

663
00:26:22,770 --> 00:26:25,850
the stock market still, or having managed money,

664
00:26:25,950 --> 00:26:28,550
or having structured investments, and things like that.

665
00:26:28,750 --> 00:26:31,690
You can confidently stay invested even when markets

666
00:26:31,690 --> 00:26:34,990
are volatile, because you have your, essentially, your

667
00:26:34,990 --> 00:26:37,550
guaranteed paycheck from your retirement assets paying you,

668
00:26:37,550 --> 00:26:40,550
from social security, to annuities, to pension, what

669
00:26:40,550 --> 00:26:40,950
have you.

670
00:26:41,450 --> 00:26:44,170
As the current makes money, or as the

671
00:26:44,170 --> 00:26:45,870
market goes up and makes money, you harvest.

672
00:26:46,070 --> 00:26:49,990
Harvest it for vacation spending, gifting it to

673
00:26:49,990 --> 00:26:52,490
children, grandchildren if you want to, or even

674
00:26:52,490 --> 00:26:54,150
replenishing your canoe if you want to, so

675
00:26:54,150 --> 00:26:57,150
that you can increase your guaranteed income for

676
00:26:57,150 --> 00:26:57,790
the future.

677
00:26:58,690 --> 00:27:00,270
And then if the market isn't going down,

678
00:27:00,410 --> 00:27:01,350
you just don't touch it.

679
00:27:01,390 --> 00:27:02,130
You let it recover.

680
00:27:02,430 --> 00:27:05,250
As we know, as we financial professionals know,

681
00:27:05,250 --> 00:27:08,150
markets go up and down, but the common

682
00:27:08,150 --> 00:27:09,630
theme is it does always go back up

683
00:27:09,630 --> 00:27:09,950
again.

684
00:27:11,330 --> 00:27:13,650
And so we can be patient about it,

685
00:27:13,670 --> 00:27:15,210
because we're not worried about having to make

686
00:27:15,210 --> 00:27:16,310
sure bills are paid.

687
00:27:17,070 --> 00:27:19,270
So when I sit down with somebody and

688
00:27:19,270 --> 00:27:21,230
we have their initial framework, tell me what

689
00:27:21,230 --> 00:27:22,390
your monthly expenses are.

690
00:27:22,730 --> 00:27:24,370
Let's just say $5,000 a month.

691
00:27:25,090 --> 00:27:25,590
Okay, great.

692
00:27:25,630 --> 00:27:26,910
Let's pad that by another thousand.

693
00:27:27,190 --> 00:27:30,070
So now we need $72,000 a year.

694
00:27:30,710 --> 00:27:31,870
How do we find that?

695
00:27:32,550 --> 00:27:35,190
So we just if there are gaps to

696
00:27:35,190 --> 00:27:36,790
needing that from what they're getting from social

697
00:27:36,790 --> 00:27:39,590
security, and let's say pension, if they have

698
00:27:39,590 --> 00:27:42,230
it, then we fund it with using an

699
00:27:42,230 --> 00:27:44,890
annuity, a good income paying annuity.

700
00:27:45,350 --> 00:27:47,670
And then whatever else they have left over,

701
00:27:47,810 --> 00:27:49,290
we invest it in the market and manage

702
00:27:49,290 --> 00:27:51,530
it based on their risk profile.

703
00:27:52,010 --> 00:27:56,910
Good framework, which focuses on making sure that

704
00:27:56,910 --> 00:28:01,830
what's needed first is essentially covered.

705
00:28:02,090 --> 00:28:04,550
And then from there, they can move on

706
00:28:04,550 --> 00:28:08,610
to kind of taking next steps, but hopefully

707
00:28:08,610 --> 00:28:12,630
puts your clients in a comfortable zone where

708
00:28:12,630 --> 00:28:16,810
they know that the mandatory, the must-haves

709
00:28:16,810 --> 00:28:18,270
are covered.

710
00:28:19,290 --> 00:28:22,410
When we talked leading up to you joining

711
00:28:22,410 --> 00:28:26,390
the Wicked Pissa podcast, we talked about a

712
00:28:26,390 --> 00:28:29,170
little bit about your career and about just

713
00:28:29,170 --> 00:28:33,150
kind of as advisors, trying to connect with

714
00:28:33,150 --> 00:28:38,590
clients and trying to, we're very familiar with

715
00:28:38,590 --> 00:28:47,610
strategies and markets and details of investment tools

716
00:28:47,610 --> 00:28:48,950
and products.

717
00:28:49,610 --> 00:28:51,170
And a lot of times it makes a

718
00:28:51,170 --> 00:28:54,010
lot of sense to us, but what we're

719
00:28:54,010 --> 00:28:57,210
trying to do apart from the handful of

720
00:28:57,210 --> 00:29:00,650
clients that really want to dig in and

721
00:29:00,650 --> 00:29:03,410
get their hands dirty and understand it almost

722
00:29:03,410 --> 00:29:06,250
as well as we do, most of our

723
00:29:06,250 --> 00:29:09,330
clients just want to know that they can

724
00:29:09,330 --> 00:29:12,050
rely on their advisor to do what's right

725
00:29:12,050 --> 00:29:15,430
for them, to be fair, open, and transparent

726
00:29:15,430 --> 00:29:21,330
with them, and to help them achieve their

727
00:29:21,330 --> 00:29:24,310
financial goals and their life goals and make

728
00:29:24,310 --> 00:29:28,510
sure that their finances will provide for those.

729
00:29:28,950 --> 00:29:33,610
But it can be difficult to frame the

730
00:29:33,610 --> 00:29:37,630
what and the why for our clients in

731
00:29:37,630 --> 00:29:39,690
a way that's easy for them to understand.

732
00:29:40,250 --> 00:29:42,850
You came up with a way that made

733
00:29:42,850 --> 00:29:46,330
sense, so much so that you released a

734
00:29:46,330 --> 00:29:49,790
book this summer that I referred to in

735
00:29:49,790 --> 00:29:50,810
our opening.

736
00:29:51,190 --> 00:29:54,050
It makes perfect sense that as you've discussed

737
00:29:54,050 --> 00:29:55,970
some of the work you do with clients

738
00:29:55,970 --> 00:29:59,790
and how you make for a successful retirement

739
00:29:59,790 --> 00:30:03,330
financially for them, you've referred to the canoe

740
00:30:03,330 --> 00:30:07,210
and the current in sharing some of those

741
00:30:07,210 --> 00:30:07,890
strategies.

742
00:30:08,330 --> 00:30:10,850
But you released what, in August, your book,

743
00:30:10,950 --> 00:30:12,570
The Canoe and the Current, is that correct?

744
00:30:12,970 --> 00:30:14,190
Yes, August 1st.

745
00:30:14,210 --> 00:30:15,350
Oh, that's fantastic.

746
00:30:15,790 --> 00:30:19,550
So having gone through it, The Canoe and

747
00:30:19,550 --> 00:30:24,550
the Current is a very cool metaphor in

748
00:30:24,550 --> 00:30:27,990
the book that you use of a canoeist

749
00:30:28,510 --> 00:30:29,550
navigating a river.

750
00:30:30,430 --> 00:30:33,010
And obviously from what you've touched on, that's

751
00:30:33,010 --> 00:30:40,150
your clients kind of navigating their journey and

752
00:30:40,150 --> 00:30:44,890
trying to stay on a safe path and

753
00:30:45,670 --> 00:30:50,990
knowing that there's unseen risks that they're unaware

754
00:30:50,990 --> 00:30:55,270
of up ahead down the river.

755
00:30:55,670 --> 00:30:57,510
Tell us a little bit more about what

756
00:30:57,510 --> 00:31:01,290
led you to that book and to coming

757
00:31:01,290 --> 00:31:04,610
up with that story and how to frame

758
00:31:04,610 --> 00:31:09,050
things for clients and really what the story

759
00:31:09,050 --> 00:31:09,990
tells in the book.

760
00:31:10,530 --> 00:31:15,030
Well, so part of the inspiration for the

761
00:31:15,030 --> 00:31:18,670
book too is there's a lot of, there's

762
00:31:18,670 --> 00:31:21,810
so much information out in the marketplace today

763
00:31:21,810 --> 00:31:26,710
with different opinions and biases that I thought

764
00:31:26,710 --> 00:31:30,270
that it just really, the consumer is paralyzed

765
00:31:30,270 --> 00:31:31,590
by information.

766
00:31:31,810 --> 00:31:33,090
So they can't make decisions.

767
00:31:34,130 --> 00:31:35,710
So the way I looked at it was,

768
00:31:35,830 --> 00:31:38,330
if we can just simplify things, right?

769
00:31:38,370 --> 00:31:41,170
I mean, we're taught the two different ways

770
00:31:42,110 --> 00:31:43,770
to have retirement planning.

771
00:31:44,010 --> 00:31:47,310
You have the flooring, the flooring strategy and

772
00:31:47,310 --> 00:31:49,710
the buckets, the time segment strategy.

773
00:31:50,650 --> 00:31:52,670
But I thought it'd be better to talk

774
00:31:52,670 --> 00:31:55,230
about it in a form of imagine you

775
00:31:55,230 --> 00:31:56,570
built a canoe.

776
00:31:56,930 --> 00:31:58,290
This is going to be part of your

777
00:31:58,290 --> 00:31:58,930
retirement plan.

778
00:31:59,050 --> 00:32:00,290
And then you're going to, your retirement plan

779
00:32:00,290 --> 00:32:02,450
is going to ride down this river down,

780
00:32:02,570 --> 00:32:03,410
up from this mountain.

781
00:32:03,530 --> 00:32:05,110
And you're just going to, you're going to

782
00:32:05,110 --> 00:32:06,630
ride the current down and the current is

783
00:32:06,630 --> 00:32:07,870
a stock market, right?

784
00:32:08,050 --> 00:32:09,530
But if you have a solid enough canoe,

785
00:32:09,570 --> 00:32:10,530
you're not going to worry about what the

786
00:32:10,530 --> 00:32:11,510
current is going to do for you because

787
00:32:11,510 --> 00:32:13,610
your canoe will withstand any of the obstacles

788
00:32:13,610 --> 00:32:15,110
that comes your way.

789
00:32:15,450 --> 00:32:16,930
But what you want is you want a

790
00:32:16,930 --> 00:32:20,130
current that's smooth at times, maybe rough at

791
00:32:20,130 --> 00:32:22,090
times, but because it's rough, it gets you

792
00:32:22,090 --> 00:32:24,990
to your destination faster, but then also avoid

793
00:32:24,990 --> 00:32:27,550
some of the obstacles that come along, whether

794
00:32:27,550 --> 00:32:29,250
they're little rocks and things like that.

795
00:32:29,470 --> 00:32:32,050
I wanted to oversimplify the retirement talk and

796
00:32:32,050 --> 00:32:34,450
in doing so, that's how the canoe and

797
00:32:34,450 --> 00:32:34,990
the current came up.

798
00:32:35,290 --> 00:32:37,430
You build your canoe, make sure it's solid.

799
00:32:37,870 --> 00:32:38,730
Let's build your essentials.

800
00:32:39,370 --> 00:32:42,190
Make sure that you have that paycheck that

801
00:32:42,190 --> 00:32:44,110
comes in to just cover all your expenses.

802
00:32:44,430 --> 00:32:46,090
And let's pad it a little bit so

803
00:32:46,090 --> 00:32:46,830
you're not pressured.

804
00:32:47,470 --> 00:32:50,190
And then whatever's left over, let's invest that

805
00:32:50,190 --> 00:32:52,630
in market type instruments because that's where we're

806
00:32:52,630 --> 00:32:55,290
going to get the best gains as far

807
00:32:55,290 --> 00:32:56,330
as keeping up with inflation.

808
00:32:57,090 --> 00:33:00,230
And then as you gain, we harvest.

809
00:33:00,590 --> 00:33:02,270
Not all of it, we harvest some of

810
00:33:02,270 --> 00:33:03,730
it or all of it based on that.

811
00:33:04,410 --> 00:33:05,710
And then like I said, you use that

812
00:33:05,710 --> 00:33:09,810
for your vacations, for pleasure expenses or gifting

813
00:33:09,810 --> 00:33:13,470
to children and grandchildren or replenish your canoe

814
00:33:13,470 --> 00:33:15,750
so that you increase your income in the

815
00:33:15,750 --> 00:33:16,050
future.

816
00:33:18,790 --> 00:33:22,690
Because there's so much information, I wanted to

817
00:33:22,690 --> 00:33:24,090
oversimplify things for people.

818
00:33:24,490 --> 00:33:25,950
That way, it makes it easier for them

819
00:33:25,950 --> 00:33:26,590
to make the decision.

820
00:33:26,810 --> 00:33:28,410
And so in that case, once they say,

821
00:33:28,550 --> 00:33:29,830
I get it, great.

822
00:33:29,950 --> 00:33:30,790
So what are we going to put in

823
00:33:30,790 --> 00:33:31,110
the canoe?

824
00:33:31,990 --> 00:33:33,710
Boom, we give them the ideas that should

825
00:33:33,710 --> 00:33:34,570
be funded in the canoe.

826
00:33:34,970 --> 00:33:36,610
And then how are we going to handle

827
00:33:36,610 --> 00:33:37,030
the current?

828
00:33:37,890 --> 00:33:39,610
Boom, here's how we're to invest that money

829
00:33:39,610 --> 00:33:40,090
in the current.

830
00:33:41,090 --> 00:33:44,150
And I think that just separates it for

831
00:33:44,150 --> 00:33:47,030
people and gives them clarity so that they

832
00:33:47,030 --> 00:33:49,430
know that they're going to have this guaranteed

833
00:33:49,430 --> 00:33:51,330
income coming in regardless of what happens in

834
00:33:51,330 --> 00:33:51,630
the market.

835
00:33:52,310 --> 00:33:54,550
And then if the market is volatile, they

836
00:33:54,550 --> 00:33:57,650
know based on how currents are, currents will

837
00:33:57,650 --> 00:33:59,790
be smooth and rough at times, but they

838
00:33:59,790 --> 00:34:03,210
can then withstand any volatility primarily because they

839
00:34:03,210 --> 00:34:04,810
have the guaranteed income coming in.

840
00:34:05,290 --> 00:34:07,790
And that just simplifies it for them it's

841
00:34:07,790 --> 00:34:09,310
easier for them to make it to say,

842
00:34:09,510 --> 00:34:11,050
great, I get it now.

843
00:34:11,810 --> 00:34:16,449
Do you have clients that ask about or

844
00:34:16,449 --> 00:34:20,409
raise concerns about social security and what that

845
00:34:20,409 --> 00:34:24,370
might do to the viability of their canoe?

846
00:34:24,969 --> 00:34:26,010
So it's funny.

847
00:34:26,429 --> 00:34:29,750
I think I said earlier, I'm kind of

848
00:34:29,750 --> 00:34:32,489
a cynical person when it comes to our

849
00:34:32,489 --> 00:34:33,469
industry a little bit.

850
00:34:34,350 --> 00:34:35,949
So I've been doing this for almost 30

851
00:34:35,949 --> 00:34:36,530
years.

852
00:34:36,989 --> 00:34:39,389
And there's a common theme in my career

853
00:34:39,389 --> 00:34:41,710
is we don't know if social security is

854
00:34:41,710 --> 00:34:43,909
going to be there when we retire.

855
00:34:45,290 --> 00:34:50,170
And so clients, they voice that concern.

856
00:34:51,230 --> 00:34:52,710
But at the end of the day, I

857
00:34:52,710 --> 00:34:55,090
say, I don't see how it's going to

858
00:34:55,090 --> 00:34:58,830
go away without a revolution happening because this

859
00:34:58,830 --> 00:35:01,290
was money that was, hate to say it,

860
00:35:01,290 --> 00:35:04,170
forcefully taken out of our paychecks to fund

861
00:35:04,170 --> 00:35:04,330
it.

862
00:35:04,610 --> 00:35:07,630
So the government would have to figure out

863
00:35:07,630 --> 00:35:10,230
a way to either pay us back or

864
00:35:10,230 --> 00:35:12,170
in the case of the solve for them

865
00:35:12,170 --> 00:35:14,670
as they're just increasing retirement age.

866
00:35:14,910 --> 00:35:17,170
I probably should worry about it, but I

867
00:35:17,170 --> 00:35:19,510
don't make that a concern because I say,

868
00:35:19,570 --> 00:35:21,850
it is an obligation based on how you've

869
00:35:21,850 --> 00:35:23,670
already funded this in the past.

870
00:35:24,070 --> 00:35:25,830
Now, if they decide to take it away,

871
00:35:26,350 --> 00:35:29,050
then I think we're going to have some

872
00:35:29,050 --> 00:35:30,090
major problems.

873
00:35:30,670 --> 00:35:34,390
But at the same token, call it a

874
00:35:34,390 --> 00:35:36,630
marketing tool in our industry or call it

875
00:35:36,630 --> 00:35:40,130
a way to engage people in conversation to

876
00:35:40,130 --> 00:35:43,070
create value that, hey, we have to plan

877
00:35:43,070 --> 00:35:44,490
for if social security goes away.

878
00:35:45,190 --> 00:35:47,390
I just don't see that happening.

879
00:35:47,810 --> 00:35:51,090
The same thing they always talked about throughout

880
00:35:51,090 --> 00:35:51,530
my career.

881
00:35:51,950 --> 00:35:54,130
Taxes have to go up because of our

882
00:35:54,130 --> 00:35:54,590
deficit.

883
00:35:55,670 --> 00:35:57,490
Well, have taxes gone up?

884
00:35:57,890 --> 00:35:58,830
Not really.

885
00:35:59,150 --> 00:36:01,070
I don't think we're going to see taxes

886
00:36:01,070 --> 00:36:02,950
going back to 90% back in the

887
00:36:02,950 --> 00:36:04,010
fifties and sixties.

888
00:36:04,450 --> 00:36:07,310
I'm a little more cynical about what we're

889
00:36:07,310 --> 00:36:07,690
hearing.

890
00:36:08,530 --> 00:36:11,510
So I always tell people, we're dealt a

891
00:36:11,510 --> 00:36:13,470
set of cards, play with that set of

892
00:36:13,470 --> 00:36:16,190
cards and be cautious about what's around the

893
00:36:16,190 --> 00:36:19,530
corner, but we can't worry about something that

894
00:36:19,530 --> 00:36:20,870
may or may not necessarily happen.

895
00:36:21,130 --> 00:36:22,890
We just have to be cautious about it.

896
00:36:23,170 --> 00:36:23,270
Yeah.

897
00:36:23,330 --> 00:36:27,110
And unfortunately it's, I work with a lot

898
00:36:27,110 --> 00:36:32,110
of clients who social security is by no

899
00:36:32,110 --> 00:36:37,010
means a make or break to their financial

900
00:36:37,010 --> 00:36:38,610
success in retirement.

901
00:36:39,250 --> 00:36:44,510
So oftentimes their question is more about when

902
00:36:44,510 --> 00:36:47,390
should I claim it because I don't want

903
00:36:47,390 --> 00:36:48,230
it to be gone.

904
00:36:48,930 --> 00:36:50,870
It gets shorted my money.

905
00:36:51,650 --> 00:36:55,490
But I do also have clients that their

906
00:36:55,490 --> 00:36:58,530
ability to collect on social security and sometimes

907
00:36:58,530 --> 00:37:02,190
at a very specific level, the level that

908
00:37:02,190 --> 00:37:07,690
their social security statement says that they anticipate

909
00:37:07,690 --> 00:37:10,430
being paid out as is important to them.

910
00:37:10,630 --> 00:37:14,730
So I much prefer the clients that, that

911
00:37:14,730 --> 00:37:16,730
I can say, let's plan for no social

912
00:37:16,730 --> 00:37:17,770
security at all.

913
00:37:17,850 --> 00:37:19,890
And, you know, let's look at how things

914
00:37:19,890 --> 00:37:21,530
are going to look and you're still going

915
00:37:21,530 --> 00:37:22,470
to be successful.

916
00:37:22,470 --> 00:37:25,110
And they're very happy and they can grumble

917
00:37:25,110 --> 00:37:27,770
a little bit about down the road.

918
00:37:27,870 --> 00:37:29,590
They think the government's going to screw them

919
00:37:29,590 --> 00:37:31,370
over for the money they paid in, as

920
00:37:31,370 --> 00:37:33,930
opposed to the people that clients that it

921
00:37:33,930 --> 00:37:35,790
really makes a difference to.

922
00:37:36,210 --> 00:37:38,610
But yeah, I just don't think the politicians

923
00:37:38,610 --> 00:37:41,750
have the appetite to rock that boat.

924
00:37:42,110 --> 00:37:44,630
And at best, they might have to, there

925
00:37:44,630 --> 00:37:48,230
might be tweaks to it, but it's not,

926
00:37:48,930 --> 00:37:52,470
as you said, it would be, we'd probably

927
00:37:52,470 --> 00:37:55,370
have bigger problems if something happened and it

928
00:37:55,370 --> 00:37:59,010
went away entirely than the lack of getting

929
00:37:59,010 --> 00:38:01,210
repaid social security.

930
00:38:01,810 --> 00:38:02,030
Yeah.

931
00:38:02,730 --> 00:38:04,730
But like I said, it's been said throughout

932
00:38:04,730 --> 00:38:07,970
my career, you can expect social security to

933
00:38:07,970 --> 00:38:09,310
be gone by the time you need it.

934
00:38:10,170 --> 00:38:13,090
And I just know that my maximum age

935
00:38:13,090 --> 00:38:13,790
has just increased.

936
00:38:13,950 --> 00:38:14,350
That's all.

937
00:38:14,690 --> 00:38:14,790
So.

938
00:38:15,430 --> 00:38:15,710
Right.

939
00:38:16,330 --> 00:38:17,270
There will be tweaks.

940
00:38:17,650 --> 00:38:19,930
So it's a very cool story.

941
00:38:20,310 --> 00:38:22,750
And I love the, you know, the metaphor

942
00:38:22,750 --> 00:38:25,730
of the river and the canoe.

943
00:38:26,210 --> 00:38:29,350
Have you found that it's been helpful to

944
00:38:29,350 --> 00:38:34,310
you in framing the discussions with clients using

945
00:38:34,310 --> 00:38:35,890
those metaphors?

946
00:38:36,690 --> 00:38:38,890
Do clients seem to understand it?

947
00:38:38,950 --> 00:38:40,550
Can you see a light bulb go on

948
00:38:40,550 --> 00:38:41,190
over their heads?

949
00:38:41,590 --> 00:38:42,690
Yeah, absolutely.

950
00:38:43,050 --> 00:38:45,910
Because I think we're all guilty of this.

951
00:38:46,110 --> 00:38:48,070
We fall into the trap of jargon.

952
00:38:49,210 --> 00:38:52,670
So having this metaphor as a conversation piece

953
00:38:52,670 --> 00:38:53,990
removes that.

954
00:38:54,710 --> 00:38:56,130
You know, it just basically, like I said,

955
00:38:56,250 --> 00:38:57,150
oversimplifies it.

956
00:38:57,390 --> 00:38:59,130
When you're talking to somebody who's getting to

957
00:38:59,130 --> 00:39:03,190
retire, their main objective, if they haven't articulated

958
00:39:03,190 --> 00:39:05,390
it, is to make sure you don't run

959
00:39:05,390 --> 00:39:05,910
out of income.

960
00:39:06,870 --> 00:39:10,250
And it's a different approach versus making sure

961
00:39:10,250 --> 00:39:11,290
that we grow our assets.

962
00:39:11,890 --> 00:39:13,490
Now, we still want to grow some assets

963
00:39:13,490 --> 00:39:14,070
for sure.

964
00:39:14,170 --> 00:39:15,970
But the main objective now is to make

965
00:39:15,970 --> 00:39:17,190
sure you don't run out of income.

966
00:39:17,730 --> 00:39:20,150
And that's a different mindset and a different

967
00:39:20,150 --> 00:39:20,790
conversation.

968
00:39:21,650 --> 00:39:23,450
Most people don't necessarily think of it that

969
00:39:23,450 --> 00:39:23,730
way.

970
00:39:23,850 --> 00:39:25,030
What they think of is running out of

971
00:39:25,030 --> 00:39:25,270
money.

972
00:39:25,750 --> 00:39:27,450
Take too much of our assets.

973
00:39:27,630 --> 00:39:28,670
At some point, we're going to run out

974
00:39:28,670 --> 00:39:28,990
of money.

975
00:39:29,230 --> 00:39:31,170
Okay, that's a different subset.

976
00:39:31,790 --> 00:39:33,890
But the main thing is making sure that

977
00:39:33,890 --> 00:39:37,450
first and foremost, that income comes in regularly

978
00:39:37,450 --> 00:39:39,030
and you don't have to worry about it.

979
00:39:39,610 --> 00:39:41,830
And so that's why I said, instead of

980
00:39:41,830 --> 00:39:44,390
industry jargon, like, oh, let's do this and

981
00:39:44,390 --> 00:39:46,070
make sure that we have your dividends paying

982
00:39:46,070 --> 00:39:48,110
out, excuse me, where we're getting enough yield

983
00:39:48,110 --> 00:39:49,130
from bonds and blah, blah, blah.

984
00:39:49,290 --> 00:39:50,370
So we just oversimplify it.

985
00:39:50,370 --> 00:39:51,450
Let's make sure that you have a solid

986
00:39:51,450 --> 00:39:52,930
canoe that gives you the guaranteed income you

987
00:39:52,930 --> 00:39:53,150
need.

988
00:39:54,110 --> 00:39:56,570
You'll now be able to invest confidently and

989
00:39:56,570 --> 00:39:57,950
knowing that as long as you have your

990
00:39:57,950 --> 00:40:00,930
guaranteed income coming in, you can take some

991
00:40:00,930 --> 00:40:03,290
small risk or some risk investing in the

992
00:40:03,290 --> 00:40:04,790
market because we still need to grow your

993
00:40:04,790 --> 00:40:05,230
assets.

994
00:40:05,890 --> 00:40:08,030
So yeah, a light bulb does come on.

995
00:40:08,170 --> 00:40:09,490
I'll give you a great one example.

996
00:40:10,010 --> 00:40:13,610
I often refer to this particular client when

997
00:40:13,610 --> 00:40:14,550
I'm doing interviews.

998
00:40:14,850 --> 00:40:16,350
And you may or may not have had

999
00:40:16,350 --> 00:40:17,250
this experience.

1000
00:40:17,490 --> 00:40:20,370
But with her, I've worked with her for

1001
00:40:20,370 --> 00:40:22,230
about six years now.

1002
00:40:23,330 --> 00:40:27,210
And throughout that six-year process, she still

1003
00:40:27,210 --> 00:40:29,170
continued to engage other advisors.

1004
00:40:29,750 --> 00:40:31,430
And I knew she was, and in fact,

1005
00:40:31,450 --> 00:40:33,410
she withdrew some money from my accounts, put

1006
00:40:33,410 --> 00:40:34,830
it with another advisor, so on and so

1007
00:40:34,830 --> 00:40:35,090
forth.

1008
00:40:35,770 --> 00:40:37,970
When I finally wrote the book and gave

1009
00:40:37,970 --> 00:40:40,970
her a copy and she read it, she

1010
00:40:40,970 --> 00:40:43,970
says, oh my gosh, I think you finally,

1011
00:40:43,970 --> 00:40:46,850
I finally met, now I know you understand

1012
00:40:46,850 --> 00:40:47,530
my situation.

1013
00:40:48,310 --> 00:40:50,390
And I was like, wait a minute, I've

1014
00:40:50,390 --> 00:40:51,530
always understood your situation.

1015
00:40:51,710 --> 00:40:54,310
So it took this book to make you

1016
00:40:54,310 --> 00:40:57,290
realize that I understand your situation.

1017
00:40:57,350 --> 00:40:57,890
She's like, yes.

1018
00:40:58,750 --> 00:41:01,250
So she's like, she likes to listen to

1019
00:41:01,250 --> 00:41:04,170
financial talks, but she now runs everything through

1020
00:41:04,170 --> 00:41:07,550
me and she's getting ready to retire and

1021
00:41:07,550 --> 00:41:09,410
she's concerned about does she have enough income?

1022
00:41:09,790 --> 00:41:10,450
I said, yes.

1023
00:41:10,670 --> 00:41:13,610
And again, we're going to finalize this plan

1024
00:41:13,610 --> 00:41:16,370
for once you have a specific date in

1025
00:41:16,370 --> 00:41:16,630
mind.

1026
00:41:17,370 --> 00:41:20,210
But it took her six years and my

1027
00:41:20,210 --> 00:41:22,590
book, really it took my book to help

1028
00:41:22,590 --> 00:41:27,050
her understand that I understand her plight or

1029
00:41:27,050 --> 00:41:27,650
her situation.

1030
00:41:28,190 --> 00:41:29,150
I don't want to say it's weird.

1031
00:41:30,850 --> 00:41:32,770
The book certainly is an eye-opener for

1032
00:41:32,770 --> 00:41:37,270
me because the reviews I've gotten from people

1033
00:41:37,270 --> 00:41:40,250
who have shared their thoughts after reading the

1034
00:41:40,250 --> 00:41:42,050
book, you've made this so much easier to

1035
00:41:42,050 --> 00:41:42,450
understand.

1036
00:41:42,990 --> 00:41:47,030
And so, yeah, light bulbs do go on

1037
00:41:47,030 --> 00:41:49,650
when people read it.

1038
00:41:49,950 --> 00:41:54,110
It's amazing how it took something this simple

1039
00:41:54,110 --> 00:41:57,790
versus, like I said, making it more complicated

1040
00:41:57,790 --> 00:42:00,930
or sophisticated with jargon or with charts and

1041
00:42:00,930 --> 00:42:02,690
numbers and stuff like that.

1042
00:42:03,110 --> 00:42:04,590
If we just say, listen, here's what you

1043
00:42:04,590 --> 00:42:06,910
need, you need $5,000 a month, just

1044
00:42:06,910 --> 00:42:09,130
an example, boom, here's how we get it.

1045
00:42:09,530 --> 00:42:11,830
Now that we have that, what should we

1046
00:42:11,830 --> 00:42:12,810
do with the rest of what you have?

1047
00:42:13,150 --> 00:42:13,890
That's great.

1048
00:42:13,990 --> 00:42:17,150
It sounds like it definitely landed with her.

1049
00:42:17,850 --> 00:42:22,330
And as we discussed, it's easy for us

1050
00:42:22,330 --> 00:42:25,450
as advisors who are in the weeds with

1051
00:42:25,450 --> 00:42:29,110
this stuff to slide very quickly back into

1052
00:42:29,110 --> 00:42:34,390
a lot of details and minutia, whereas clients,

1053
00:42:34,510 --> 00:42:36,710
as you said, want to be understood, want

1054
00:42:36,710 --> 00:42:38,150
to know that we care and want to

1055
00:42:38,150 --> 00:42:39,910
know that we have a plan.

1056
00:42:39,910 --> 00:42:42,070
They don't need to know all the details

1057
00:42:42,070 --> 00:42:44,050
of what that plan is.

1058
00:42:44,130 --> 00:42:45,130
They just want to know.

1059
00:42:45,670 --> 00:42:48,810
And in this case, she understood that she

1060
00:42:48,810 --> 00:42:51,030
needed a plan for income, that you understood

1061
00:42:51,030 --> 00:42:51,470
it.

1062
00:42:52,670 --> 00:42:55,390
And that gave her comfort that you were

1063
00:42:55,390 --> 00:42:59,010
on the same page to move forward in

1064
00:42:59,010 --> 00:43:00,730
that retirement journey.

1065
00:43:01,530 --> 00:43:01,690
Yeah.

1066
00:43:01,730 --> 00:43:03,450
She has more than enough, by the way.

1067
00:43:04,410 --> 00:43:07,170
And she's still worried she doesn't have enough.

1068
00:43:07,650 --> 00:43:09,290
And I told her, you will be just

1069
00:43:09,290 --> 00:43:12,910
fine once we set this in stone.

1070
00:43:13,770 --> 00:43:15,770
So she says, okay.

1071
00:43:16,350 --> 00:43:17,850
But I said, don't worry.

1072
00:43:19,810 --> 00:43:21,990
She's finalizing a date and then we can

1073
00:43:21,990 --> 00:43:23,230
set it in stone as far as the

1074
00:43:23,230 --> 00:43:23,850
actual plan.

1075
00:43:24,670 --> 00:43:25,770
But I told her, I said, you have

1076
00:43:25,770 --> 00:43:26,370
more than enough.

1077
00:43:26,490 --> 00:43:27,330
You'll be fine.

1078
00:43:28,570 --> 00:43:29,310
That's great.

1079
00:43:29,310 --> 00:43:34,910
So in the book, there's obviously the major

1080
00:43:34,910 --> 00:43:38,950
metaphors of the canoe and the river, but

1081
00:43:38,950 --> 00:43:44,590
there's canoeing related types of metaphors used in

1082
00:43:44,590 --> 00:43:45,490
the book.

1083
00:43:45,850 --> 00:43:48,210
One of the things that I looked at,

1084
00:43:48,390 --> 00:43:51,990
picked up on was you referred to drifting

1085
00:43:51,990 --> 00:43:54,070
in the book and early in the book.

1086
00:43:54,070 --> 00:43:57,250
Explain kind of how you define what drifting

1087
00:43:57,250 --> 00:43:57,710
is.

1088
00:43:58,150 --> 00:44:00,490
Well, I think just going blindly.

1089
00:44:00,990 --> 00:44:02,630
You're just going blindly going along.

1090
00:44:02,790 --> 00:44:05,930
I mean, not understanding what you're going through.

1091
00:44:06,050 --> 00:44:07,410
So that's why I said part of the

1092
00:44:07,410 --> 00:44:09,230
reason for the metaphor is to give them

1093
00:44:09,230 --> 00:44:09,830
some clarity.

1094
00:44:10,290 --> 00:44:12,530
So you know exactly what the canoe is

1095
00:44:12,530 --> 00:44:12,790
doing.

1096
00:44:12,930 --> 00:44:14,990
And then you're going to have some ideas.

1097
00:44:15,310 --> 00:44:17,270
You may not understand everything because it's an

1098
00:44:17,270 --> 00:44:19,650
investor in the market, but basically it's just

1099
00:44:19,650 --> 00:44:22,130
going along without knowing what you're really doing.

1100
00:44:22,130 --> 00:44:24,210
And as I said earlier, we have some,

1101
00:44:24,570 --> 00:44:26,810
I've dealt with people who we want to

1102
00:44:26,810 --> 00:44:29,310
stay invested where we are because this particular

1103
00:44:29,310 --> 00:44:30,690
mutual fund is doing quite well.

1104
00:44:31,150 --> 00:44:33,570
And we don't want to move it just

1105
00:44:33,570 --> 00:44:33,850
yet.

1106
00:44:33,930 --> 00:44:34,990
I would call that drifting.

1107
00:44:35,890 --> 00:44:39,050
And that's some of the people that oftentimes

1108
00:44:39,050 --> 00:44:41,230
are the overconfident ones.

1109
00:44:41,630 --> 00:44:44,990
They're drifting and think that, and sometimes they

1110
00:44:44,990 --> 00:44:48,410
do, but oftentimes they don't have enough and

1111
00:44:48,410 --> 00:44:50,530
aren't aware of what the potential risks are

1112
00:44:50,530 --> 00:44:55,150
ahead that can derail what their success might

1113
00:44:55,150 --> 00:44:55,530
be.

1114
00:44:56,230 --> 00:44:57,730
But they don't think that they need it.

1115
00:44:57,830 --> 00:45:02,670
So there they go overconfidently drifting down the

1116
00:45:02,670 --> 00:45:02,950
river.

1117
00:45:03,330 --> 00:45:04,050
And you know what?

1118
00:45:04,230 --> 00:45:06,110
And sometimes you have to let them go

1119
00:45:06,110 --> 00:45:06,870
through it.

1120
00:45:06,890 --> 00:45:08,350
Not because you're going to tell them I

1121
00:45:08,350 --> 00:45:10,850
told you so, but because they just need

1122
00:45:10,850 --> 00:45:13,950
to experience it to kind of realize that

1123
00:45:13,950 --> 00:45:15,990
you have to have a plan and not

1124
00:45:15,990 --> 00:45:19,970
just ride the current, not having a plan.

1125
00:45:20,570 --> 00:45:22,990
You may be going down the river, but

1126
00:45:22,990 --> 00:45:25,510
you still have to navigate.

1127
00:45:26,370 --> 00:45:27,210
You don't just drift.

1128
00:45:27,290 --> 00:45:28,030
You still have to navigate.

1129
00:45:28,330 --> 00:45:29,350
You still need your oar.

1130
00:45:30,710 --> 00:45:34,470
And so some people just, they don't bother

1131
00:45:34,470 --> 00:45:39,630
to navigate because let's say they've done it

1132
00:45:39,630 --> 00:45:40,190
on their own.

1133
00:45:40,310 --> 00:45:42,150
Oh, my 401k plan has done great.

1134
00:45:42,770 --> 00:45:44,210
I'm going to keep it there even though

1135
00:45:44,210 --> 00:45:45,670
I'm retired now, just because I know it's

1136
00:45:45,670 --> 00:45:46,090
done great.

1137
00:45:46,170 --> 00:45:47,350
They're not rolling it over to an IRA.

1138
00:45:47,610 --> 00:45:48,550
They just want to keep it there at

1139
00:45:48,550 --> 00:45:48,990
this point.

1140
00:45:49,710 --> 00:45:50,990
Or at least if they do, they're going

1141
00:45:50,990 --> 00:45:52,510
to keep it to within the same funds

1142
00:45:52,510 --> 00:45:54,570
and the same strategy without really adjusting anything.

1143
00:45:55,310 --> 00:45:56,690
And they just drift along.

1144
00:45:57,070 --> 00:45:58,550
Again, like I said, in the last few

1145
00:45:58,550 --> 00:46:03,070
years, besides COVID, markets have done quite well.

1146
00:46:04,490 --> 00:46:08,190
So it's easy to be overconfident.

1147
00:46:08,190 --> 00:46:11,910
So you just mentioned the oar.

1148
00:46:12,110 --> 00:46:17,190
And my recollection was the oar in the

1149
00:46:17,190 --> 00:46:22,550
story represents my ability to be part of

1150
00:46:22,550 --> 00:46:26,070
that plan and have control kind of over

1151
00:46:26,070 --> 00:46:29,450
where the canoe goes, whether or not that

1152
00:46:29,450 --> 00:46:33,150
gets me into some form of peril or

1153
00:46:33,150 --> 00:46:33,450
not.

1154
00:46:33,570 --> 00:46:36,050
But I do have some control over that.

1155
00:46:36,050 --> 00:46:38,650
Is that correct as to what the oar,

1156
00:46:38,750 --> 00:46:40,990
it might've been the paddle represented in the

1157
00:46:40,990 --> 00:46:41,110
book?

1158
00:46:41,310 --> 00:46:43,150
So basically, like I said, as long as

1159
00:46:43,150 --> 00:46:45,590
you have a solid canoe, you can take

1160
00:46:45,590 --> 00:46:48,390
risks with what part of the current you

1161
00:46:48,390 --> 00:46:49,070
want to ride.

1162
00:46:49,990 --> 00:46:53,550
So some people will say, I never want

1163
00:46:53,550 --> 00:46:54,470
to get into any rough.

1164
00:46:55,870 --> 00:46:57,690
And some people say, I sure, I don't

1165
00:46:57,690 --> 00:46:58,850
mind some of that because it's a little

1166
00:46:58,850 --> 00:46:59,350
bit exciting.

1167
00:46:59,530 --> 00:47:02,290
It's a the canoe is the main piece.

1168
00:47:02,770 --> 00:47:06,150
You navigate the current based on obviously how

1169
00:47:06,150 --> 00:47:07,150
we're investing that.

1170
00:47:07,630 --> 00:47:10,090
And then it allows us to pivot if

1171
00:47:10,090 --> 00:47:10,610
we need to.

1172
00:47:10,710 --> 00:47:12,570
It allows us to make changes as necessary

1173
00:47:13,130 --> 00:47:16,770
without compromising your ability to cover all of

1174
00:47:16,770 --> 00:47:17,690
your essential expenses.

1175
00:47:18,930 --> 00:47:22,170
So that's where people still want obviously a

1176
00:47:22,170 --> 00:47:23,930
level of involvement and control.

1177
00:47:24,670 --> 00:47:26,790
And so we just help them navigate through

1178
00:47:26,790 --> 00:47:30,110
those things and make sure that number one

1179
00:47:30,110 --> 00:47:33,050
is once the canoe solid, we will invest

1180
00:47:33,050 --> 00:47:34,970
your money in instruments that we will help

1181
00:47:34,970 --> 00:47:35,810
you understand better.

1182
00:47:36,590 --> 00:47:38,710
Now you may not understand it fully, but

1183
00:47:38,710 --> 00:47:40,110
here's what we expect from it.

1184
00:47:40,390 --> 00:47:43,170
And here's what it could potentially do from

1185
00:47:43,170 --> 00:47:44,170
a positive standpoint.

1186
00:47:44,270 --> 00:47:45,790
And here's what the potential negatives are.

1187
00:47:46,310 --> 00:47:49,010
And then we'll just navigate through that based

1188
00:47:49,010 --> 00:47:51,630
on where we are at that time.

1189
00:47:51,730 --> 00:47:53,870
So if it's positive and we're doing well,

1190
00:47:54,230 --> 00:47:54,750
we'll harvest.

1191
00:47:55,090 --> 00:47:56,870
If it's negative and not doing well at

1192
00:47:56,870 --> 00:47:59,530
that time, we hold off on harvesting so

1193
00:47:59,530 --> 00:48:00,970
that we don't realize a loss.

1194
00:48:01,430 --> 00:48:03,050
We wait for it to bounce back.

1195
00:48:03,150 --> 00:48:06,630
The book you referenced about the ability of

1196
00:48:06,630 --> 00:48:09,730
if you have a solid canoe being able

1197
00:48:09,730 --> 00:48:14,290
to take advantage or choose to ride in

1198
00:48:14,290 --> 00:48:19,430
some more risky areas of the river.

1199
00:48:19,930 --> 00:48:21,190
What about rapids?

1200
00:48:21,250 --> 00:48:23,590
The book talked about rapids at one point,

1201
00:48:23,650 --> 00:48:24,090
I believe.

1202
00:48:24,230 --> 00:48:26,470
I think that was something a little bit

1203
00:48:26,470 --> 00:48:30,890
different than taking on just some more risky

1204
00:48:30,890 --> 00:48:31,890
parts of the river.

1205
00:48:32,070 --> 00:48:33,190
What were rapids?

1206
00:48:33,630 --> 00:48:34,770
I don't have anything.

1207
00:48:35,110 --> 00:48:37,030
I don't recall writing anything about rapids.

1208
00:48:37,690 --> 00:48:41,090
Crises, things like that were unexpected.

1209
00:48:42,350 --> 00:48:44,710
Maybe something along the line of your client

1210
00:48:44,710 --> 00:48:48,410
with what happened to their daughter that was

1211
00:48:48,410 --> 00:48:53,050
very serious as well as unexpected as opposed

1212
00:48:53,050 --> 00:48:57,450
to just something as treacherous as just being

1213
00:48:57,450 --> 00:48:58,750
invested in the market.

1214
00:48:58,970 --> 00:49:02,010
But my notes might have been incorrect.

1215
00:49:02,390 --> 00:49:05,990
I call them silent killers in the book.

1216
00:49:06,850 --> 00:49:09,690
And perhaps I probably should have used rapids

1217
00:49:09,690 --> 00:49:12,510
instead because that actually would be a little

1218
00:49:12,510 --> 00:49:14,410
bit, now that you mention it, that's more

1219
00:49:14,410 --> 00:49:15,210
in line with the metaphor.

1220
00:49:15,490 --> 00:49:18,710
But the silent killers, of course, are more

1221
00:49:18,710 --> 00:49:19,590
long-term care.

1222
00:49:20,170 --> 00:49:21,630
If you have to take care of somebody,

1223
00:49:21,730 --> 00:49:23,210
in this case, in the case of my

1224
00:49:23,210 --> 00:49:26,010
client that I referred to, they don't have

1225
00:49:26,010 --> 00:49:27,830
long-term care issues with each other, but

1226
00:49:27,830 --> 00:49:29,210
now they have a long-term care issue

1227
00:49:29,210 --> 00:49:29,850
with their daughter.

1228
00:49:31,350 --> 00:49:33,150
That was something that no one expected.

1229
00:49:33,430 --> 00:49:36,010
That was, let's say, a rapid or shall

1230
00:49:36,010 --> 00:49:38,330
we say a rock that's in the way

1231
00:49:38,330 --> 00:49:41,870
that your canoe is going to hit.

1232
00:49:42,050 --> 00:49:44,790
But again, their canoe is solid, so they're

1233
00:49:44,790 --> 00:49:46,930
not necessarily worried about that.

1234
00:49:47,310 --> 00:49:51,430
In their case, their concern is we're not...

1235
00:49:51,430 --> 00:49:53,110
And this is not meant to sound like

1236
00:49:53,110 --> 00:49:55,670
they don't care about their daughter.

1237
00:49:55,770 --> 00:49:58,270
What I'm trying to say is this is

1238
00:49:58,270 --> 00:49:59,690
not what they expected at retirement.

1239
00:49:59,830 --> 00:50:02,650
They expected to travel as they were doing

1240
00:50:02,650 --> 00:50:04,690
prior to this happening.

1241
00:50:05,490 --> 00:50:10,910
So in essence, going back to this example,

1242
00:50:11,150 --> 00:50:13,670
they traveled for the first time this year

1243
00:50:13,670 --> 00:50:17,210
in five years because they've been taking care

1244
00:50:17,210 --> 00:50:17,490
of her.

1245
00:50:17,930 --> 00:50:21,490
And so they finally found somebody, a caregiver

1246
00:50:21,490 --> 00:50:24,490
that they can use for their daughter, so

1247
00:50:24,490 --> 00:50:25,610
they were able to travel this year.

1248
00:50:26,010 --> 00:50:28,310
But again, it wasn't extended travel like they're

1249
00:50:28,310 --> 00:50:28,950
accustomed to.

1250
00:50:29,210 --> 00:50:31,530
It's a short travel back to their home

1251
00:50:31,530 --> 00:50:34,590
state to visit old friends and family.

1252
00:50:35,690 --> 00:50:37,670
So yeah, I would say that would be

1253
00:50:37,670 --> 00:50:43,430
an example of a rapid in the case

1254
00:50:43,430 --> 00:50:46,050
that you mentioned or the silent killer that

1255
00:50:46,050 --> 00:50:50,570
we mentioned, healthcare costs, things that are unexpected.

1256
00:50:52,530 --> 00:50:53,630
And like I said, long-term care is

1257
00:50:53,630 --> 00:50:58,110
probably the biggest one just because...

1258
00:50:58,110 --> 00:50:59,930
I mean, the statistics have been the same

1259
00:50:59,930 --> 00:51:01,070
ever since 30 years ago.

1260
00:51:01,190 --> 00:51:02,910
70% of seniors are going to experience

1261
00:51:02,910 --> 00:51:04,330
some sort of long-term care event.

1262
00:51:04,710 --> 00:51:05,770
That hasn't changed.

1263
00:51:06,190 --> 00:51:08,950
You can use rapid in the second edition

1264
00:51:08,950 --> 00:51:09,590
release.

1265
00:51:09,870 --> 00:51:10,070
Yes.

1266
00:51:10,210 --> 00:51:12,590
I really like that terminology better.

1267
00:51:13,350 --> 00:51:15,410
I'm surprised my editor and I didn't catch

1268
00:51:15,410 --> 00:51:15,790
that.

1269
00:51:17,430 --> 00:51:21,250
No need to give me credit, but maybe

1270
00:51:21,250 --> 00:51:23,070
I came up with that as I was

1271
00:51:23,070 --> 00:51:24,790
making my notes about it.

1272
00:51:25,130 --> 00:51:28,310
So perhaps you can write the forward on

1273
00:51:28,310 --> 00:51:31,550
the second edition and take credit for changing

1274
00:51:31,550 --> 00:51:32,290
some of the language.

1275
00:51:32,770 --> 00:51:37,010
So the important piece for all of us

1276
00:51:37,010 --> 00:51:42,470
as advisors is to provide, to be that

1277
00:51:42,470 --> 00:51:44,010
guide in the canoe.

1278
00:51:44,590 --> 00:51:49,210
Overconfidence, lack of confidence, not knowing what you

1279
00:51:49,210 --> 00:51:49,990
don't know.

1280
00:51:50,430 --> 00:51:52,870
Part of what we do and what we

1281
00:51:52,870 --> 00:51:56,810
provide is through our many years of experience

1282
00:51:56,810 --> 00:52:01,230
is kind of knowing what they have to

1283
00:52:01,230 --> 00:52:04,730
look at or be mindful of is risks

1284
00:52:04,730 --> 00:52:07,270
around the corner down the river, correct?

1285
00:52:08,130 --> 00:52:11,970
In essence, we are the guide for the

1286
00:52:11,970 --> 00:52:15,110
river rafting canoe trip, right?

1287
00:52:15,230 --> 00:52:16,130
We are the guide.

1288
00:52:16,550 --> 00:52:18,950
One of my clients said, your book came

1289
00:52:18,950 --> 00:52:19,690
in just in time.

1290
00:52:19,890 --> 00:52:21,890
I was in a river rafting excursion with

1291
00:52:21,890 --> 00:52:25,290
my children and the guide, she showed me

1292
00:52:25,290 --> 00:52:26,430
a picture and there's a guide in the

1293
00:52:26,430 --> 00:52:28,930
back, making sure the back of the raft,

1294
00:52:29,290 --> 00:52:30,870
they're staying safe and stuff like that.

1295
00:52:30,930 --> 00:52:33,130
So we are essentially the guide to the

1296
00:52:33,130 --> 00:52:33,410
canoe.

1297
00:52:33,850 --> 00:52:35,570
It's a great, great story.

1298
00:52:35,830 --> 00:52:41,210
I think it provides a nice visual for

1299
00:52:41,210 --> 00:52:47,750
clients to understand what they're doing, what your

1300
00:52:47,750 --> 00:52:50,910
role is, what their role is, how they

1301
00:52:50,910 --> 00:52:56,290
can visualize retirement and what it takes to

1302
00:52:56,290 --> 00:52:59,890
get there, both in terms of planning and

1303
00:52:59,890 --> 00:53:02,850
visualizing their own retirement as well as to

1304
00:53:02,850 --> 00:53:06,110
what are the tools to help them get

1305
00:53:06,110 --> 00:53:10,390
there in terms of making sure they have

1306
00:53:10,390 --> 00:53:14,770
that steady stream of income to cover their

1307
00:53:14,770 --> 00:53:20,310
most needed expenses and then to responsibly be

1308
00:53:20,310 --> 00:53:24,050
able to take on some potential risk to

1309
00:53:24,050 --> 00:53:27,370
live some of the goals that they have

1310
00:53:27,370 --> 00:53:29,530
beyond their basic needs.

1311
00:53:31,230 --> 00:53:32,930
One of the things that I think is

1312
00:53:32,930 --> 00:53:37,410
great too is kind of envisioning in the

1313
00:53:37,410 --> 00:53:40,830
book talks about kind of create, for lack

1314
00:53:40,830 --> 00:53:42,970
of a better term, I guess I would

1315
00:53:42,970 --> 00:53:45,570
say is creating what their river is going

1316
00:53:45,570 --> 00:53:47,950
to look like and kind of what that

1317
00:53:47,950 --> 00:53:49,930
purpose in life is.

1318
00:53:49,950 --> 00:53:52,450
Is that kind of part of the vision

1319
00:53:52,450 --> 00:53:52,950
of it?

1320
00:53:52,950 --> 00:53:55,750
So basically, the analogy could go, or the

1321
00:53:55,750 --> 00:53:58,250
metaphor could go, I want to ride a

1322
00:53:58,250 --> 00:53:59,930
river down as I retire.

1323
00:54:00,130 --> 00:54:01,190
I want to build my canoe.

1324
00:54:01,750 --> 00:54:04,790
Now let's select which river we cruise down

1325
00:54:04,790 --> 00:54:04,930
from.

1326
00:54:05,330 --> 00:54:06,850
So that's kind of the idea.

1327
00:54:06,970 --> 00:54:09,310
So you get to select based on how

1328
00:54:09,310 --> 00:54:12,070
solid your canoe is built, which river to

1329
00:54:12,070 --> 00:54:12,730
sail on.

1330
00:54:13,230 --> 00:54:14,750
If you have a solid enough canoe, then

1331
00:54:14,750 --> 00:54:16,810
perhaps it can take more risk.

1332
00:54:17,470 --> 00:54:19,130
If you don't feel as solid about it,

1333
00:54:19,170 --> 00:54:23,690
then obviously you take a slower current type

1334
00:54:23,690 --> 00:54:24,550
river, right?

1335
00:54:25,830 --> 00:54:27,390
I didn't use this in the book, but

1336
00:54:27,390 --> 00:54:31,970
imagine you're climbing up this mountain.

1337
00:54:32,170 --> 00:54:33,330
So you want to ride this river down

1338
00:54:33,330 --> 00:54:34,570
and you have your canoe with you.

1339
00:54:34,630 --> 00:54:35,590
You've built a solid canoe.

1340
00:54:35,910 --> 00:54:37,890
Then you ride the river and guide yourself

1341
00:54:37,890 --> 00:54:40,270
through the river based on the current you

1342
00:54:40,270 --> 00:54:42,510
want to, the risk you're willing to take,

1343
00:54:42,570 --> 00:54:43,990
so to speak, which currents you want to

1344
00:54:43,990 --> 00:54:46,710
ride, or you want to avoid the tough

1345
00:54:46,710 --> 00:54:48,670
rapids and you want to go for the

1346
00:54:48,670 --> 00:54:50,630
smoother rapids, whatever it might be.

1347
00:54:50,710 --> 00:54:53,170
But certainly that would be the concept.

1348
00:54:53,590 --> 00:54:54,690
I love the story.

1349
00:54:55,050 --> 00:54:57,250
It's a very, very cool one.

1350
00:54:57,390 --> 00:55:00,630
And as we said, it's always great to

1351
00:55:00,630 --> 00:55:03,610
try to find a nice way to help

1352
00:55:03,610 --> 00:55:07,110
our clients very easily understand what we're trying

1353
00:55:07,110 --> 00:55:08,610
to do for them.

1354
00:55:08,610 --> 00:55:12,730
And this is Landing for Clients, and you

1355
00:55:12,730 --> 00:55:16,210
are able to really find a nice way

1356
00:55:16,210 --> 00:55:21,730
to help frame retirement planning into a cool

1357
00:55:21,730 --> 00:55:25,930
framework and visual and a nice story as

1358
00:55:25,930 --> 00:55:26,530
well.

1359
00:55:27,050 --> 00:55:30,250
Anything else about the book or kind of

1360
00:55:30,250 --> 00:55:32,610
how you came up with it or how

1361
00:55:32,610 --> 00:55:36,310
it applies to retirement planning that you'd like

1362
00:55:36,310 --> 00:55:38,950
to share before we jump off?

1363
00:55:39,370 --> 00:55:41,990
I think it comes down to, at the

1364
00:55:41,990 --> 00:55:43,770
end of the day, the one common theme

1365
00:55:43,770 --> 00:55:46,270
that I've learned throughout my career when I

1366
00:55:46,270 --> 00:55:49,090
worked early, and it's still common, is people

1367
00:55:49,090 --> 00:55:50,310
are worried about running out of money.

1368
00:55:50,650 --> 00:55:52,630
Even wealthy people, they're running out of money.

1369
00:55:52,990 --> 00:55:55,090
The other thing is, the first firm I

1370
00:55:55,090 --> 00:55:58,370
was with, I remember the founder of the

1371
00:55:58,370 --> 00:56:02,530
firm said, it doesn't really matter what you

1372
00:56:02,530 --> 00:56:02,930
know.

1373
00:56:03,630 --> 00:56:06,970
It's being able to convey the right message

1374
00:56:06,970 --> 00:56:08,890
to your client first.

1375
00:56:09,290 --> 00:56:12,170
The tools, the tactics come next.

1376
00:56:12,630 --> 00:56:15,350
But really, what you want to communicate is

1377
00:56:15,350 --> 00:56:17,110
how you can help them achieve their goals

1378
00:56:17,110 --> 00:56:20,770
and objectives in a simple and concise and

1379
00:56:20,770 --> 00:56:21,430
clear manner.

1380
00:56:22,050 --> 00:56:23,470
The tools will come after that.

1381
00:56:23,910 --> 00:56:26,270
But if you talk about the tools, oftentimes,

1382
00:56:26,970 --> 00:56:28,310
people are just not going to get it.

1383
00:56:28,370 --> 00:56:31,110
So you need get them to make sure

1384
00:56:31,110 --> 00:56:33,170
that they understand the strategy and then the

1385
00:56:33,170 --> 00:56:34,090
tactics come next.

1386
00:56:34,510 --> 00:56:36,230
So really, that's kind of how I designed

1387
00:56:36,230 --> 00:56:36,590
the book.

1388
00:56:36,790 --> 00:56:38,430
For people in our business, they might say

1389
00:56:38,430 --> 00:56:39,290
it's oversimplified.

1390
00:56:39,650 --> 00:56:42,170
But I think it's really simplified for a

1391
00:56:42,170 --> 00:56:42,410
purpose.

1392
00:56:42,550 --> 00:56:44,990
It's to just get the concept down, build

1393
00:56:44,990 --> 00:56:45,870
your solid canoe.

1394
00:56:46,410 --> 00:56:47,790
That way, you don't have to fear the

1395
00:56:47,790 --> 00:56:48,950
current, the market.

1396
00:56:50,170 --> 00:56:53,910
And so I think most people fail in

1397
00:56:53,910 --> 00:56:56,790
some cases with their finances because they lead

1398
00:56:56,790 --> 00:56:59,210
with fear and not confidence.

1399
00:56:59,730 --> 00:57:01,270
So if you have a solid canoe that's

1400
00:57:01,270 --> 00:57:02,690
going to pay you a paycheck for the

1401
00:57:02,690 --> 00:57:04,150
rest of your life that you know will

1402
00:57:04,150 --> 00:57:06,270
not run out, then you can invest in

1403
00:57:06,270 --> 00:57:06,770
confidence.

1404
00:57:07,190 --> 00:57:10,850
What's going to give you your financial security

1405
00:57:10,850 --> 00:57:11,850
is being able to do that.

1406
00:57:12,470 --> 00:57:16,250
Now, the second piece of this is, obviously,

1407
00:57:16,430 --> 00:57:18,650
the idea is let's help you build the

1408
00:57:18,650 --> 00:57:21,650
canoe that's solid, a retirement plan that's solid.

1409
00:57:22,090 --> 00:57:24,270
So once you've done that, part three of

1410
00:57:24,270 --> 00:57:25,650
the book talks about how can you be

1411
00:57:25,650 --> 00:57:27,070
a better steward of your money at that

1412
00:57:27,070 --> 00:57:27,390
point?

1413
00:57:28,590 --> 00:57:31,650
In which case, what sort of legacy would

1414
00:57:31,650 --> 00:57:34,310
you like to leave behind to your children

1415
00:57:34,310 --> 00:57:34,950
and grandchildren?

1416
00:57:36,630 --> 00:57:38,450
We talked about this before the call and

1417
00:57:38,450 --> 00:57:39,150
I just mentioned it.

1418
00:57:39,270 --> 00:57:40,810
I do have a second book that's ready

1419
00:57:40,810 --> 00:57:41,310
to publish.

1420
00:57:41,950 --> 00:57:43,870
It's really going to complement this first book.

1421
00:57:44,510 --> 00:57:46,990
And it's really about what sort of values

1422
00:57:46,990 --> 00:57:49,250
do you want to leave behind for your

1423
00:57:49,250 --> 00:57:50,170
family?

1424
00:57:51,350 --> 00:57:53,910
And in that case, perhaps creating a family

1425
00:57:53,910 --> 00:57:58,290
financial philosophy so that your children and grandchildren

1426
00:57:58,290 --> 00:58:02,410
know how you've built your wealth, at least

1427
00:58:02,410 --> 00:58:04,390
the money that you have, and then how

1428
00:58:04,390 --> 00:58:05,890
you would like that to be treated once

1429
00:58:05,890 --> 00:58:06,390
you're gone.

1430
00:58:07,170 --> 00:58:08,890
And then how would you like the next

1431
00:58:08,890 --> 00:58:11,450
generation to be stewards of the money you've

1432
00:58:11,450 --> 00:58:12,710
built and the wealth that you've built?

1433
00:58:13,330 --> 00:58:15,750
It's the idea there is to encourage people

1434
00:58:15,750 --> 00:58:19,350
to not hide what they've done with their

1435
00:58:19,350 --> 00:58:19,610
money.

1436
00:58:19,910 --> 00:58:22,530
Because whenever I do speaking engagements, I always

1437
00:58:22,530 --> 00:58:24,850
refer to my favorite term, people are funny

1438
00:58:24,850 --> 00:58:25,630
when it comes to money.

1439
00:58:25,910 --> 00:58:27,250
People are funny when it comes to money.

1440
00:58:27,590 --> 00:58:30,590
Some families, they don't want their children to

1441
00:58:30,590 --> 00:58:32,970
know anything about how they built their wealth.

1442
00:58:33,490 --> 00:58:35,850
Some families, they want to make sure they're

1443
00:58:35,850 --> 00:58:36,450
sharing.

1444
00:58:37,510 --> 00:58:39,210
But I think in a lot of cases,

1445
00:58:39,470 --> 00:58:41,710
I think based on my observation, the more

1446
00:58:41,710 --> 00:58:45,790
you share, the more you build values with

1447
00:58:45,790 --> 00:58:47,770
your children and grandchildren, the more they can

1448
00:58:47,770 --> 00:58:49,050
appreciate what you've done.

1449
00:58:50,170 --> 00:58:55,190
And hopefully, when you're gone, they treat whatever's

1450
00:58:55,190 --> 00:58:57,850
passed on to them with better stewardship than

1451
00:58:57,850 --> 00:58:59,910
if they just got it without any purpose.

1452
00:59:00,770 --> 00:59:02,730
At the end of the day, you build

1453
00:59:02,730 --> 00:59:05,550
money with a purpose, you use it with

1454
00:59:05,550 --> 00:59:07,570
purpose, and you transfer it with purpose.

1455
00:59:07,990 --> 00:59:11,470
Look forward to that one coming out as

1456
00:59:11,470 --> 00:59:12,430
well, Patrick.

1457
00:59:12,490 --> 00:59:13,130
You've been busy.

1458
00:59:13,650 --> 00:59:15,510
Where can our listeners find your book?

1459
00:59:16,390 --> 00:59:19,450
The book's available on Amazon, The Canoe and

1460
00:59:19,450 --> 00:59:20,230
The Current.

1461
00:59:20,910 --> 00:59:22,950
You can also look them up by author

1462
00:59:22,950 --> 00:59:24,310
if you want to, Patrick Nagato.

1463
00:59:25,310 --> 00:59:26,970
I also have a website for the book

1464
00:59:26,970 --> 00:59:29,170
called canoeandcurrent.com.

1465
00:59:29,890 --> 00:59:31,570
If anybody wants to reach out to me

1466
00:59:31,570 --> 00:59:32,910
directly, I'm available on LinkedIn.

1467
00:59:33,390 --> 00:59:35,250
I am the only Patrick Nagato on LinkedIn

1468
00:59:35,250 --> 00:59:36,210
that I'm aware of.

1469
00:59:36,690 --> 00:59:38,850
It's a very unique name, but feel free

1470
00:59:38,850 --> 00:59:40,250
to reach out on LinkedIn as well.

1471
00:59:41,350 --> 00:59:42,230
That's great.

1472
00:59:42,470 --> 00:59:43,750
What are the chances of that?

1473
00:59:44,130 --> 00:59:47,470
Even with a somewhat unique name, the chances

1474
00:59:47,470 --> 00:59:49,330
of that seem crazy.

1475
00:59:49,930 --> 00:59:51,810
I look forward to hearing from anybody who

1476
00:59:51,810 --> 00:59:52,850
wants to reach out.

1477
00:59:53,490 --> 00:59:58,830
I'm more than open in welcoming comments, conversations,

1478
00:59:59,050 --> 00:59:59,750
and stuff like that.

1479
01:00:00,030 --> 01:00:00,990
Kevin, thank you.

1480
01:00:01,050 --> 01:00:02,250
I appreciate being able to speak to your

1481
01:00:02,250 --> 01:00:02,530
audience.

1482
01:00:02,850 --> 01:00:04,750
And to all our members out there and

1483
01:00:04,750 --> 01:00:07,390
others listening, if you are interested in learning

1484
01:00:07,390 --> 01:00:11,350
more about FPA of New England, upcoming educational

1485
01:00:11,350 --> 01:00:14,290
and social events, or resources available to you

1486
01:00:14,290 --> 01:00:17,030
as an advisor, you can learn more at

1487
01:00:19,090 --> 01:00:22,510
financialplanningassociation.org, where you can find information on

1488
01:00:22,510 --> 01:00:24,970
our chapter under the networking tab.

1489
01:00:25,470 --> 01:00:28,690
Also, please connect with us on LinkedIn if

1490
01:00:28,690 --> 01:00:31,410
you haven't already, where you'll find the latest

1491
01:00:31,410 --> 01:00:32,650
news and updates.

1492
01:00:33,070 --> 01:00:34,950
And we look forward to connecting with you

1493
01:00:34,950 --> 01:00:37,530
on the next episode of the Wicked PISA

1494
01:00:37,530 --> 01:00:38,250
Podcast.

1495
01:00:38,550 --> 01:00:40,290
If you'd like to learn more about the

1496
01:00:40,290 --> 01:00:44,410
Financial Planning Association or FPA New England, visit

1497
01:00:44,410 --> 01:00:49,250
our websites, financialplanningassociation.org for the National Association

1498
01:00:49,250 --> 01:00:51,910
or fpanewengland.org.

1499
01:00:52,010 --> 01:00:54,710
You can learn more about our organization and

1500
01:00:54,710 --> 01:00:56,290
all the upcoming chapter events.

1501
01:00:56,870 --> 01:00:57,610
We hope you'll join.

1502
01:00:58,230 --> 01:01:00,530
That's fpanewengland.org.

1503
01:01:00,870 --> 01:01:02,930
Until next time, have a wicked good day.